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TOPIC: Get out of debt free website.

Get out of debt free website. 07 Oct 2012 17:36 #1

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An excellent site this...check it out. :cool:

www.getoutofdebtfree.org/
Welcome to the Get Out of Debt Free online community

Our aim is to empower you to overcome your personal debt, by
understanding the fraudulent nature of our banking system. We offer
FREE template letters and simple strategies for a permanent debt solution. With online support from our large community forum and resources including video tutorials, it's time to beat the banks and be debt free Now!
The pen is mightier than the sword
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Get out of debt free website. 07 Oct 2012 17:51 #2

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That's good info, DG.

Especially since more plans are afoot to hamper people's income...

Your right to resell your own stuff is in peril
It could become illegal to resell your iPhone 4, car or family antiques

By Jennifer Waters, MarketWatch
CHICAGO (MarketWatch) — Tucked into the U.S. Supreme Court’s busy agenda this fall is a little-known case that could upend your ability to resell everything from your grandmother’s antique furniture to your iPhone 4.

At issue in Kirtsaeng v. John Wiley & Sons is the first-sale doctrine in copyright law, which allows you to buy and then sell things like electronics, books, artwork and furniture as well as CDs and DVDs, without getting permission from the copyright holder of those products.

Under the doctrine, which the Supreme Court has recognized since 1908, you can resell your stuff without worry because the copyright holder only had control over the first sale.

Put simply, though Apple has the copyright on the iPhone and Mark Owen does on the book “No Easy Day,” you can still sell your copies to whomever you please whenever you want without retribution.

That’s being challenged now for products that are made abroad and if the Supreme Court upholds an appellate court ruling it would mean that the copyright holders of anything you own that has been made in China, Japan or Europe, for example, would have to give you permission to sell it.


The rest of it's here...

www.marketwatch.com/story/your-right-to-resell-your-own-stuff-is-in-peril-2012-10-04?pagenumber=1
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Get out of debt free website. 08 Oct 2012 03:09 #3

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That should be good for a laugh! One the court system is so corrupt that there is every chance that they would impose such a ruling in favour of the manufacturer/copyright holder. This is the same legal system that sanctioned GMO and patent laws on living things! If that isn't obvious corruption and a display of insanity I have no idea what is.

The real fun part will be when companies accept that and make it part of their terms of trading. I would hazard a guess that the first company that stipulated that it endorsed that ruling, and rigorously pursue breaches of it would be out of business, with rather large amounts of stock piled up in their warehouses.

Where do these fucking clowns come from that forward these pathetic ideas?

Bring it on the more shit like this the better - folk will really start to get an idea of what these cretins are all about and how they get away with it. :cool:

"Whenever you're in conflict with someone, there is one factor that can make the difference between damaging your relationship and deepening it. That factor is attitude." William James
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Get out of debt free website. 27 Jun 2014 23:02 #4

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The only way to really get out of debt is to do a Hitler or JFK and create a national currency. Plus ban usury and speculation. A nation that permits Wonga to thrive is doomed
To understand who rules over you look to whom you tube can't criticise

The media isn't there to cover the news
It's there to cover the news up

All establishment lies pass through three stages
First, they are accepted as being self evident
Second, they are exposed by diligent research
Third, they are enforced

"Communism is the bloodiest, most difficult and the most terrible way from capitalism to capitalism" from Under the Sign of the Scorpion by Juri Lina
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Get out of debt free website. 13 Jul 2014 01:31 #5

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Don Argus is the former CEO of one of Australia's largest banks, former chairman of BHP Billiton (world's largest mining company) and on the Global Advisory Board of Bank of America.

I'm not sure if he's attended Bilderberg. If he has he won't be invited back after this article.

He is stating that the West is drowning in debt and can't drive itself forward.

He wouldn't advocate austerity as from an Australian perspective that is seen as anathema to common sense. Europe is drowning in IMF imposed austerity and the IMF has recently acknowledged that austerity fails and causes vicious downward spirals. duh!!!

Debt is the yoke around our necks

DON ARGUSTHE AUSTRALIANJULY 12, 2014 12:00AM

Debt-to-GDP ratios.

THE world is full of smart, experienced people from all walks of life — all of whom have theories and wisdom to impart.

So when I look at the chart on debt, I do hope someone is going to tell us soon how we get out of this mess and restore some balance in our lives again, and satisfy expectations about maximising our financial goals and how we can achieve sustainable growth in a developed world awash with debt.

There is increasing uneasiness developing in academic research which records that when the public and private debt-to-GDP ratio moves above a range of 260-275 per cent, then it has a depressive impact on economic growth. Europe and the US are close to this threshold already, which explains why this recovery has been so painfully slow.

As much as our governments around the world want us to remain calm, cool and collected, we get inundated with economic theory, but people are not feeling positive about their future.

In Australia, consumer confidence is down. The fragility of households should hardly be a revelation when one looks at the level of consumer debt in the accompanying chart.

Unemployment might be stable for the moment, yet many families seem to have someone unemployed or not working as much as they would like. The unemployment rate in the under-24 age group is 13 per cent and rising, and when you adjust for the fall in the participation rate true youth unemployment could be as high as 18 per cent.

Disposable income is being tested to the limit, with rising living expenses not providing the buying power we had become accustomed to over the last 15 years.

We have this thing called debt hanging around our neck, and instead of spending what disposable income we have left we are encouraged to save as much as we can for our retirement through a superannuation scheme that is being tarnished by so-called investment advisers exploiting unsuspecting superannuants.

People are not money stupid, they are life smart, and there is stress in how we fund the programs that make our wish list and which of course are unfunded.

It is time to talk about growth initiatives which create real value for our economy, it is time to talk about trade-offs, because we are now at a stage where we cannot afford further government or private debt, and it is also time to get educated on what deflation can do to an economy which is in denial about growth trends.

If we do not get back to the ­basics of living with balanced budgets then any new initiatives will only come from either foregoing existing expenditure to accommodate new spending, or undertaking capital expenditure which has been properly costed to allow productivity gains to be achieved so that we can return to a standard of living to which we have become accustomed.

I am not suggesting yet that we are heading for an era of deflation, but unless this political nonsense around our budget is resolved quickly, we had better prepare ourselves for a period of declining demand which puts downward pressure on prices for goods and services with a resultant decline in private and government spending.

That scenario can unfortunately lead to deflation, something we have not seen in this country since the early 1930s.

Don Argus is a member of the Bank of America Global Advisory Council, chairman of the Bank of America Merrill Lynch Australia advisory board and director of the Australian Foundation Investment Company. He is the former chairman of BHP Billiton and Brambles, and a former chief executive of NAB.

m.theaustralian.com.au/business/opinion/debt-is-the-yoke-around-our-necks/story-e6frg9if-1226986186946
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Get out of debt free website. 13 Jul 2014 01:38 #6

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And the issue with deflation is?

"Whenever you're in conflict with someone, there is one factor that can make the difference between damaging your relationship and deepening it. That factor is attitude." William James
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Get out of debt free website. 13 Jul 2014 01:49 #7

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I think those calling the shots want deflation.

They want to diminish peoples net worths. Thats one issue with it perhaps. Most australians that have any kind of net worth have most of their money tied up in property.

If house prices fall, net worth falls. Most people wouldnt be pleased about that. Leading to even further reduced confidence, investment and spending.

If they dont want deflation then they dont know what they are doing.

If they do want it, then they are doing exactly what needs doing to achieve that right now, ( I agree with Argus on that. )
I am not suggesting yet that we are heading for an era of deflation, but unless this political nonsense around our budget is resolved quickly, we had better prepare ourselves for a period of declining demand which puts downward pressure on prices for goods and services with a resultant decline in private and government spending.

:yup:

I cant help but think this is all by design anyway.

I also see Frogs point about deflation, and economists going on about constant growth.

Falling prices will benefit some (in the short term only perhaps) and not others.
I remember the good old days, when 90+ year olds in nursing homes lived forever. Darn this pesky virus.

1365 = 1

1.1365 = 1,283,305,580,313,352
Last Edit: 13 Jul 2014 02:06 by novum.
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Get out of debt free website. 13 Jul 2014 01:51 #8

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Falling asset prices, low job creation, low investment etc.

Japan has experienced 20 years of deflationary cycles because of the manner it tried to but failed to deal with the bursting of the asset price bubble in the early 90s.
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Get out of debt free website. 13 Jul 2014 02:02 #9

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Orangeaid wrote:
Falling asset prices, low job creation, low investment etc.

Yep exactly... I cant help but think thats what some of them want for the place.
I remember the good old days, when 90+ year olds in nursing homes lived forever. Darn this pesky virus.

1365 = 1

1.1365 = 1,283,305,580,313,352
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Get out of debt free website. 13 Jul 2014 02:30 #10

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Property values are relative it's a totally false concept to think that falling values is a negative thing unless you are at risk through buying into the lie and accumulating debt. It was the ability to get in to debt that drove the false inflation in the first place!

How is inflation generating more jobs or even managing to retain any form of job security? The fact of the matter is that it doesn't!

The best thing that could happen for the average person in the world is a total collapse of the system and a state of deflation in western economies. What the world needs is a parity in the value of labour globally across all sectors of employment. Then and only then will people receive a far income for a days work. It would also stop plutocrats shifting the production processes to wherever the cheapest labour market is, which would stimulate local economies closest to the areas of most demand or with access to raw materials. That would also cut down on the environmental impacts associated with transporting raw materials and finished produce.

A system of constant positive growth and inflationary pressures is ultimately unsustainable over time. That's why in the early 1900's one man's wage was worth at least twice what it is today in real terms. Obviously there have been some social and labour market changes that have had an impact, but there are also some other effects that act as an off set such as the exploration of cheap foreign labour and production markets/centres.

If we want to see any sort of real change we are going to have to take the hit and redress the balance instead of having a selfish self serving attitude to wealth. It would also help if people started to understand the value of things rather than simply looking at the price.

"Whenever you're in conflict with someone, there is one factor that can make the difference between damaging your relationship and deepening it. That factor is attitude." William James
Last Edit: 13 Jul 2014 02:49 by Frog.
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Get out of debt free website. 13 Jul 2014 02:34 #11

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Yep i understand all of that and the inflation aspect which is part of the scam.

Money is only worth what it can buy. Value vs price.
I remember the good old days, when 90+ year olds in nursing homes lived forever. Darn this pesky virus.

1365 = 1

1.1365 = 1,283,305,580,313,352
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Get out of debt free website. 13 Jul 2014 02:42 #12

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falling asset prices, especially housing, would decimate the banking system. it has happened before in relatively contained ways when people who bought property with high gearing at the height of the market went into negative equity.

BUT, if you take Australia, which has a residential market worth about $6 trillion, if the market deflated by say 20% across the board , $6 trillion becomes $4.8 trillion. About 2/3 of those properties have debt on them.

The 20% devaluation would cause huge losses to the banks overtime and therefore severely limit new lending to business and 'safe prospects'.
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Get out of debt free website. 13 Jul 2014 02:44 #13

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novum wrote:
Yep i understand all of that and the inflation aspect which is part of the scam.

Money is only worth what it can buy. Value vs price.
If major deflation occurred we would be back in a Depression scenario ... which was "rescued" in the Anglo world by entering WWII.
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Get out of debt free website. 13 Jul 2014 02:49 #14

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you do what you can to live debt free.

Though for Gen X and Gen Y that has become incredibly hard to do
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Get out of debt free website. 13 Jul 2014 02:56 #15

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Orangeaid wrote:
Falling asset prices, low job creation, low investment etc.

Japan has experienced 20 years of deflationary cycles because of the manner it tried to but failed to deal with the bursting of the asset price bubble in the early 90s.

That's an absurdly simplistic view of the Japanese economy. They are ahead of the curve in terms of demographic decline because they didn't have the baby boom that the west had post world war two. The inflationary state of property was no different to that the artificial effects and corrupt banking processes that we employ in the west. Again they just hit the wall sooner than we have.

They also suffered from the corporate move towards out sourcing (exploitation of cheap labour) which is nothing short of a kamikaze run for the domestic economy.

Even that is far too simplistic to paint anything like a realistic picture.

"Whenever you're in conflict with someone, there is one factor that can make the difference between damaging your relationship and deepening it. That factor is attitude." William James
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Get out of debt free website. 13 Jul 2014 02:58 #16

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Orangeaid wrote:
novum wrote:
Yep i understand all of that and the inflation aspect which is part of the scam.

Money is only worth what it can buy. Value vs price.
If major deflation occurred we would be back in a Depression scenario ... which was "rescued" in the Anglo world by entering WWII.

That's laughable where do you think we are headed on this present inflationary course? :facepalm:

"Whenever you're in conflict with someone, there is one factor that can make the difference between damaging your relationship and deepening it. That factor is attitude." William James
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Get out of debt free website. 13 Jul 2014 03:36 #17

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Orangeaid wrote:
falling asset prices, especially housing, would decimate the banking system. it has happened before in relatively contained ways when people who bought property with high gearing at the height of the market went into negative equity.

Errr what's the problem with banks failing if they have conducted and aided bad practice they should be left to fail. There is absolutely no reason for a bank to fail if it has acted as a legitimate bank. The losses they would incur would be as a result of their lending practices and these days their speculative investments etc. The banks and lenders were primary causes of house price inflation.

Those people were foolish to get themselves in that position in the first place and their willingness to commit to debt under those circumstances drove prices up unnaturally. That's the risk they took every risk has to have a plus and minus or there is no risk. Are you suggesting that everyone should always profit from every investment and that all investments should be totally risk free? Greed and selfishness comes at a price and it's time for people to start accepting those consequences.

BUT, if you take Australia, which has a residential market worth about $6 trillion, if the market deflated by say 20% across the board , $6 trillion becomes $4.8 trillion. About 2/3 of those properties have debt on them.

Fifty or sixty years ago that couldn't have happened because debt was harder to get into and excessive debt was virtually impossible for the average man in the street. People brought into the debt deception and now the chickens are coming home to roost. A 20% correction wont be anywhere realistic enough to redress the balance. When the next hit arrives people will be trying to give property away just as they did in the early 90's. The difference is that the situation is significantly worse than it was back then and there are no industries to buy a way back out.

The 20% devaluation would cause huge losses to the banks overtime and therefore severely limit new lending to business and 'safe prospects'.

Why do we need banks to lend money? They never did lend money they facilitated access to your own sweat equity! They recorded a transaction and then handed you your own money, which they proceeded to charge you interest on. :roll: The whole thing is a total and utter scam on an unimaginable scale.

Cryptocurrencies are going to be the end of banking as we have known it. Funding is going to shift to crowd funding models. Domestic mortgages will probably return to some form of local community based credit union styled system. The younger generations have the power to finally take control of their own destinies and bring down the failing archaic systems they have inherited.

"Whenever you're in conflict with someone, there is one factor that can make the difference between damaging your relationship and deepening it. That factor is attitude." William James
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Get out of debt free website. 13 Jul 2014 04:52 #18

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Apoplithorismosphobia (Fear of Deflation) | Mark Thornton


"Whenever you're in conflict with someone, there is one factor that can make the difference between damaging your relationship and deepening it. That factor is attitude." William James
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Get out of debt free website. 13 Jul 2014 05:05 #19

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Frog wrote:
Orangeaid wrote:
Falling asset prices, low job creation, low investment etc.

Japan has experienced 20 years of deflationary cycles because of the manner it tried to but failed to deal with the bursting of the asset price bubble in the early 90s.

That's an absurdly simplistic view of the Japanese economy. They are ahead of the curve in terms of demographic decline because they didn't have the baby boom that the west had post world war two. The inflationary state of property was no different to that the artificial effects and corrupt banking processes that we employ in the west. Again they just hit the wall sooner than we have.

They also suffered from the corporate move towards out sourcing (exploitation of cheap labour) which is nothing short of a kamikaze run for the domestic economy.

Even that is far too simplistic to paint anything like a realistic picture.
Geez you get your knickers in a twist easily. I painted a high level overview of the "constipation" of the Japanese banking system that ensued from those banks having MASSIVE post bubble bad debts that they DID NOT write down or redress.

That systematic constipation caused massive problems for Japan's banks and economy in general.

Japan's domestiv economy is still closed and is controlled by home grown banks, brokers, kaw firms etc. Foreign firms can only work on international trade transactions.

The asset bubble also pushed Japanese housing prices to exorbitant levels which meant buying housing by the young Japanese was incredibly hard and many stayed with their parents.

Japan also is "xenophobic" in that it has never embraced immigration. As its population aged and the birth rate fell, which fell more with cost of living pressures, Japan didn't open the borders to prop up the economy.

All this still doesn't detract or add to what I posted about the massive problems huge bad debts caused following the implosion of the asset price bubble ... and the deflationary spiral it caused.
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Get out of debt free website. 13 Jul 2014 05:08 #20

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Frog wrote:
Orangeaid wrote:
falling asset prices, especially housing, would decimate the banking system. it has happened before in relatively contained ways when people who bought property with high gearing at the height of the market went into negative equity.

Errr what's the problem with banks failing if they have conducted and aided bad practice they should be left to fail. There is absolutely no reason for a bank to fail if it has acted as a legitimate bank. The losses they would incur would be as a result of their lending practices and these days their speculative investments etc. The banks and lenders were primary causes of house price inflation.

Those people were foolish to get themselves in that position in the first place and their willingness to commit to debt under those circumstances drove prices up unnaturally. That's the risk they took every risk has to have a plus and minus or there is no risk. Are you suggesting that everyone should always profit from every investment and that all investments should be totally risk free? Greed and selfishness comes at a price and it's time for people to start accepting those consequences.

BUT, if you take Australia, which has a residential market worth about $6 trillion, if the market deflated by say 20% across the board , $6 trillion becomes $4.8 trillion. About 2/3 of those properties have debt on them.

Fifty or sixty years ago that couldn't have happened because debt was harder to get into and excessive debt was virtually impossible for the average man in the street. People brought into the debt deception and now the chickens are coming home to roost. A 20% correction wont be anywhere realistic enough to redress the balance. When the next hit arrives people will be trying to give property away just as they did in the early 90's. The difference is that the situation is significantly worse than it was back then and there are no industries to buy a way back out.

The 20% devaluation would cause huge losses to the banks overtime and therefore severely limit new lending to business and 'safe prospects'.

Why do we need banks to lend money? They never did lend money they facilitated access to your own sweat equity! They recorded a transaction and then handed you your own money, which they proceeded to charge you interest on. :roll: The whole thing is a total and utter scam on an unimaginable scale.

Cryptocurrencies are going to be the end of banking as we have known it. Funding is going to shift to crowd funding models. Domestic mortgages will probably return to some form of local community based credit union styled system. The younger generations have the power to finally take control of their own destinies and bring down the failing archaic systems they have inherited.
That's all fine to raise hypothetically but it is not pragmatic. if it occurred we would be in a similar situation to the Great Depression. The problems would be HUGE.
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