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TOPIC: Can Ethics Really Ever Make A Come Back In Big Business?

Can Ethics Really Ever Make A Come Back In Big Business? 10 Mar 2014 13:52 #1

  • cantata
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Despite Tim Cook's impassioned statement - which caused a great deal of impassioned argument in response - can ethics ever play a part in big business again? Aren't too many of the "Big Boys" only interested in the money, prestige and money again to ever let "ethics" into matters again?

www.independent.co.uk/life-style/gadgets-and-tech/news/apples-tim-cook-business-isnt-just-about-making-a-profit-9163931.html
"...Wyrde saves oft the man undoomed
if he undaunted be....". (Beowulf).

"The most beautiful people we have known are those who have known defeat, known suffering, known struggle, known loss, and have found their way out of the depths... Beautiful people do not just happen". (Elisabeth Kubler-Ross).


:cavalier
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Can Ethics Really Ever Make A Come Back In Big Business? 11 Mar 2014 01:52 #2

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When was big business ever about ethics? As such how could it return to a position that never existed?
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Can Ethics Really Ever Make A Come Back In Big Business? 11 Mar 2014 04:34 #3

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Many years down the road i honestly think things will change....
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Can Ethics Really Ever Make A Come Back In Big Business? 11 Mar 2014 09:34 #4

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The stance of western businesses in relation to ethics is highly hypocritical. Often it is to gain mileage / political kudos to be seen as a good corporate citizen.

Such ethics regard as paramount the NON payment of bribes. This stance makes it very hard for western businesses to do business legitimately in many developing nations where payments by way of brown paper bags are the usual resolution to stoppages in an approval process or project construction. If the business wants something, a payment to the right person usually does the trick.

Western business ethics frown upon these practices, yet they are how business often gets done in developing nations.

Contrast this stance by (and this is US specific) corporations paying lobbyists to get favourable treatment in DC, and in extreme cases, to obtain support within a political party. These payments are nothing more than bribes. they oil the wheels of the US political system and perfectly legitimate. Yet a US business is prevented from making a payment in a developing nation to progress a favourable outcome for it.

Shell is another example of hypocrisy. It was correctly slated for the rampant abuse of the Nigerian environment it conducted in order to extract huge amounts of oil from underground reserves in Nigeria. the response has been very prominent policies of "corporate social responsibility". Yet current practices are nothing more than finding a viable reserve, extracting it as quickly as it can (and this applies really anywhere) then buggering off to the next project.

Again, hypocrisy.
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Can Ethics Really Ever Make A Come Back In Big Business? 11 Mar 2014 17:09 #5

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I'm not sure that Ethics in business (especially big business) has ever existed in reality. In the main I don't think it has. BUT there used to be companies like (famously) Cadbury's and Rowntrees, who appeared to give an ethical damn and went beyond eeking out meagre wages to their employees.

Even as recently as when I last lived in Leamington before this: we had a company on the way out of the top of town called Thwaites, that used to build tractors and such-like for Massey Fergusson et al. Basil Thwaites was famously philanthropic towards his employees (mind you, on what they earned for him I suppose he could afford to be) and when he died, he left in his will all the tied houses and cottages to those longer term employees who were living in them.

Perhaps ethics in business never have gone beyond the odd company or the odd employer here and there.
"...Wyrde saves oft the man undoomed
if he undaunted be....". (Beowulf).

"The most beautiful people we have known are those who have known defeat, known suffering, known struggle, known loss, and have found their way out of the depths... Beautiful people do not just happen". (Elisabeth Kubler-Ross).


:cavalier
Last Edit: 11 Mar 2014 17:25 by cantata.
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Can Ethics Really Ever Make A Come Back In Big Business? 11 Mar 2014 17:27 #6

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Cadbury's and Rowntrees were strong quaker families, and to an extent were using the Business to support their quaker ideals rather than having a business which was of itself ethical.
On the radio he other day I heard about an American man who has set up a string of shops only selling American manufactured items, (forgotten his name etc, maybe a contributor from the US could help), he said all his suppliers are family run companies, they are the only ones interested in manufacturing using American Citizens.
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Can Ethics Really Ever Make A Come Back In Big Business? 05 Apr 2014 17:51 #7

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I remember when i was a kid the best part about Easter was Cadbury cream eggs.

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Can Ethics Really Ever Make A Come Back In Big Business? 06 Apr 2014 00:47 #8

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WildHorse wrote:
now if peeps clicked that OUR power lies in where we spend and we could change so much just by that.

True dat.

WildHorse wrote:
Says me who shops at Asda :roll:

:nono: :spank:


Sorry... back on topic...

I remember the good old days, when 90+ year olds in nursing homes lived forever. Darn this pesky virus.

1365 = 1

1.1365 = 1,283,305,580,313,352
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Can Ethics Really Ever Make A Come Back In Big Business? 06 Apr 2014 05:59 #9

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novum wrote:
WildHorse wrote:
now if peeps clicked that OUR power lies in where we spend and we could change so much just by that.

True dat.

One of my friends lives by this philosophy and he is far less of an outspoken conspiracy theorist than me.

Shame on my truther ass, i got a Nike sweatsuit on right now.... :huh:
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Can Ethics Really Ever Make A Come Back In Big Business? 12 Apr 2014 20:27 #10

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The day human ethics return to business there will be no longer "Big Business" as we know it now.
Exploitation of human labour force and creativity has to be brought to an end and the money lenders need urgently be chased from the temple of humankind.

But first of all people need to understand that there is no good father figure like "state".
The governmenst are ALL illegal, corrupt to the core enterprises with overpaid politician impersonators,
who are only serving their high-finance masters instead of the people.

Same applies to the fake judges, "state" attorneys and all fake "civil servants" of the corporations disguised as real states.

Is there any consciousness on this forum for what is going on in reality?
.
"The truth must be repeated over and over again,
because error is repeatedly preached among us, not
only by individuals, but by the masses. In periodicals
and cyclopaedias, in schools and universities; every-
where, in fact, error prevails, and is quite easy in the
feeling that it has a decided majority on its side."

~ J. W. v. Goethe

Johannes Lang "The Hollow World Theory" Blog
My Zone by PFIZIPFEI
Last Edit: 12 Apr 2014 20:27 by PFIZIPFEI.
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Can Ethics Really Ever Make A Come Back In Big Business? 13 Apr 2014 02:55 #11

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PFIZIPFEI wrote:
But first of all people need to understand that there is no good father figure like "state".
The governments are ALL illegal, corrupt to the core enterprises with overpaid politician impersonators,
who are only serving their high-finance masters instead of the people.

Same applies to the fake judges, "state" attorneys and all fake "civil servants" of the corporations disguised as real states.

Is there any consciousness on this forum for what is going on in reality?
.

I think most here know these things and generally agree with some or all of the points you made in what i quoted, yes.

Especially this part...

PFIZIPFEI wrote:
who are only serving their high-finance masters instead of the people.

Dont forget they serve themselves too!

Though that said, there will always be 'spirited debate' about who these masters are exactly. :hahano:
I remember the good old days, when 90+ year olds in nursing homes lived forever. Darn this pesky virus.

1365 = 1

1.1365 = 1,283,305,580,313,352
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Can Ethics Really Ever Make A Come Back In Big Business? 15 Apr 2014 15:28 #12

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Perhaps we ought to go back to the days when we FORCED business to have "ethics":



:)
"...Wyrde saves oft the man undoomed
if he undaunted be....". (Beowulf).

"The most beautiful people we have known are those who have known defeat, known suffering, known struggle, known loss, and have found their way out of the depths... Beautiful people do not just happen". (Elisabeth Kubler-Ross).


:cavalier
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Can Ethics Really Ever Make A Come Back In Big Business? 18 Apr 2014 11:08 #13

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Sadly it has to come from the consumers I think. If you stop buying an unethical product from an unethical company then perhaps it might become more profitable for them to be ethical. I try to buy as ethically as I can. I buy Union made products where possible. Organic fair trade sustainable non gmo etc. Those types of products have been on the rise somewhat. Even coca cola now sells water in "plant based plastic bottles". So there have been ethical directions made but it came mostly from market pressure I believe.
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Can Ethics Really Ever Make A Come Back In Big Business? 26 Aug 2014 05:25 #14

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jonb wrote:
When was big business ever about ethics? As such how could it return to a position that never existed?

Henry Ford
Disgusted by the carnage of the World War in Europe, Ford chartered a “Peace Ship” in 1915 and sailed across the Atlantic to stop the war.

www.thehenryford.org/exhibits/hf/Additional_Interests_and_Activities.asp

He also published the Protocols of Zion :thumbup:

Walt Disney

www.rense.com/general91/walt.htm
To understand who rules over you look to whom you tube can't criticise

The media isn't there to cover the news
It's there to cover the news up

All establishment lies pass through three stages
First, they are accepted as being self evident
Second, they are exposed by diligent research
Third, they are enforced

"Communism is the bloodiest, most difficult and the most terrible way from capitalism to capitalism" from Under the Sign of the Scorpion by Juri Lina
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Can Ethics Really Ever Make A Come Back In Big Business? 26 Aug 2014 05:49 #15

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I can't see it occurring at all. The guiding principle of corporate actions and decision making is "acting in the best interests of shareholders" ... which means maximizing the wealth of shareholders.

Hence corporates are focused on keeping costs down and ever increasing profits. This is very much so with listed companies - especially in the US - where they report to the market quarterly so management is intensely focused on each quarter's results ... so a hire and fire mentality is rife.
Shareholder value is a business term, sometimes phrased as shareholder value maximization or as the shareholder value model, which implies that the ultimate measure of a company's success is the extent to which it enriches shareholders. It became popular during the 1980s, and is particularly associated with former CEO ofGeneral Electric, Jack Welch.

The term used in several ways:

To refer to the market capitalization of a company (rarely used)To refer to the concept that the primary goal for a company is to increase the wealthof its shareholders (owners) by paying dividends and/or causing the stock price to increaseTo refer to the more specific concept that planned actions by management and the returns to shareholders should outperform certain bench-marks such as the cost of capital concept. In essence, the idea that shareholders' money should be used to earn a higher return than they could earn themselves by investing in other assets having the same amount of risk. The term in this sense was introduced by Alfred Rappaport in 1986.

en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shareholder_value
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