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TOPIC: Edward Snowden is an Inside Job

Edward Snowden is an Inside Job 11 Jun 2013 15:54 #1



I think this guy is an inside Job, he's probably been privately contracted to fly a figurative plane into the Obama administration.

"I can't in good conscience allow the US government to destroy privacy, internet freedom and basic liberties for people around the world with this massive surveillance machine they're secretly building." -E.Snowden

The left's immediate leap to glorify him as an enemy of the US, aswell as his pro-libertarian message both serve the motives of the Conservative Establishment..
...Molti nemici molto onore...
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Edward Snowden is an Inside Job 11 Jun 2013 15:58 #2

WTF, during the Bush administration Beck would have been screaming at this guy and calling him an enemy of the State...

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Edward Snowden is an Inside Job 11 Jun 2013 16:17 #3

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I admit that some aspects, especially the timing of Snowdens whistleblowing are a tad suspicious.

However you have to remember that some people do something as an act of conscience. Even politicians ;) Not everyone is motivated by financial gain.

I'd also remember that if pushed, Snowden would have something very vital - evidence. There has been no denial, only justification from authorities.

Whatever Snowdens motives I'm glad that goverments will now be forced to ask the public what they want, or at least thinnk twice if they should for once.
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Edward Snowden is an Inside Job 11 Jun 2013 16:28 #4

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Just to clarify, the timing aspect makes me think Chinese agent. Nothing to do with tea party nonsense.

I still believe that he is probably acting out of conscience, just like I believe that Obama isn't a bad man. Wrong sometimes but not bad.
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Edward Snowden is an Inside Job 11 Jun 2013 16:47 #5

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Ultimate Seeker ™ wrote:
WTF, during the Bush administration Beck would have been screaming at this guy and calling him an enemy of the State...

True. Beck has a role to play imho.

As for Snowden, im with you guys that there may be more to it than his poor conscious couldnt take it anymore or whatever, but there could be any number of reasons why this has come about.
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Edward Snowden is an Inside Job 11 Jun 2013 17:39 #6

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Ultimate Seeker ™ wrote:
I think this guy is an inside Job, he's probably been privately contracted to fly a figurative plane into the Obama administration.

I didn't have you down as a conspiracy theorist btw. :chuckle:
1365 = 1

1.1365 = 1,283,305,580,313,352
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Edward Snowden is an Inside Job 11 Jun 2013 19:41 #7

novum wrote:
Ultimate Seeker ™ wrote:
I think this guy is an inside Job, he's probably been privately contracted to fly a figurative plane into the Obama administration.

I didn't have you down as a conspiracy theorist btw. :chuckle:
Glad you also enjoyed the irony of this :cheers:
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Edward Snowden is an Inside Job 11 Jun 2013 20:52 #8

On Sunday night, Snowden gave the last of what had been almost a week's worth of interviews. It was his final night in that hotel room: the final night before his old life gave way to a new and uncertain one. He sat on his bed, arms folded, television news on without the sound, and spoke about the debate he had started, homing in on a comment Obama had made on Friday, in response to the leaks.

"You can't have 100% security and then also have 100% privacy and zero inconvenience," the president said. Society had to make choices, he added.

Snowden challenged this, saying the problem was that the Obama administration had denied society the chance to have that discussion. He disputed that there had to be a trade-off between security and privacy, describing the very idea of a trade-off as a fundamental assault on the US constitution.

Though where he draws the idea of there having to be a complete tradeoff or absolute balance in either direction I don't know...

Yet more black and white reasoning:
"Edward Snowden: NSA whistleblower, fugitive, hero … or traitor?

Despite a blaze of publicity, the man who told the world about US government surveillance remains a mystery to many"

Practically every headline reinforces black and white reasoning..If he get's found I suspect he might claim diminished responsibility or something along those lines...seems a strange case for sure and as the now removed Glenn Beck video shows appears to be an internal agency anti-US government operation...
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Last Edit: 11 Jun 2013 20:53 by Ultimate Seeker ™.
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Edward Snowden is an Inside Job 11 Jun 2013 21:13 #9

Look at this shill here:

What a shilly anti-Obama Government shill.

Listening to Glenn Beck there it's like this could be a completely staged event.
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Last Edit: 11 Jun 2013 21:16 by Ultimate Seeker ™.
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Edward Snowden is an Inside Job 11 Jun 2013 21:27 #10

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Ultimate Seeker ™ wrote:
On Sunday night, Snowden gave the last of what had been almost a week's worth of interviews. It was his final night in that hotel room: the final night before his old life gave way to a new and uncertain one. He sat on his bed, arms folded, television news on without the sound, and spoke about the debate he had started, homing in on a comment Obama had made on Friday, in response to the leaks.

"You can't have 100% security and then also have 100% privacy and zero inconvenience," the president said. Society had to make choices, he added.

Snowden challenged this, saying the problem was that the Obama administration had denied society the chance to have that discussion. He disputed that there had to be a trade-off between security and privacy, describing the very idea of a trade-off as a fundamental assault on the US constitution.

Though where he draws the idea of there having to be a complete tradeoff or absolute balance in either direction I don't know...

Yet more black and white reasoning:
"Edward Snowden: NSA whistleblower, fugitive, hero … or traitor?

Despite a blaze of publicity, the man who told the world about US government surveillance remains a mystery to many"

Practically every headline reinforces black and white reasoning..If he get's found I suspect he might claim diminished responsibility or something along those lines...seems a strange case for sure and as the now removed Glenn Beck video shows appears to be an internal agency anti-US government operation...

I think what Obama missed out in that speech the other night is 'You can't have 100% security'

Bad stuff is going to happen.

He also missed out how ineffective the type of surveillance they are saying is needed for 100% security is against enemies who know what they are doing. With the right encryption even it will be beyond NSA capability. They might be able to crack it but years after, talking decades here. This type of surveillance is also ineffective against hardcopy. Most people who really want to do harm are clever. They have also known that this sort of stuff has been going on for years with echelon. You just won't stop some people, you really won't. It's also totally ineffective against old school subterfuge. All this is what Obama missed out on his speech.

He also missed out in his speech 'The terrorists have won because it has made of investigate innocent people without probable cause, they have caused us to go against our principles. We've already lost'

He should've finished with that bit
Last Edit: 11 Jun 2013 21:28 by username.
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Edward Snowden is an Inside Job 11 Jun 2013 21:35 #11

Good points there Username, I agree with some of them.
I don't think the terrorists have won, the historical facts the US government basically dismantled the American Communist Party through McCarthyism and CointelPro, Organized Labor in the US got chucked in a river with concrete boots between 1930 and today, what you have today is the generations of the sixties entering politics, and their children entering politics over the next few decades meaning radical changes are afoot ;)

The vanquished people's movements of the US will rise again, but not external to the Political system, we're inside it now that's where the various anti-Communist wars drove us ;)

So not only is the US fighting hostile reactionary traditional and religious forces in the global theatre, but the emerging US progressive wave is facing hostile reactionary, traditional and religious forces at home, so for me it's more like the US is beating the terrorists, at home and abroad, but it's a long process and fraught with difficulties.
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Last Edit: 11 Jun 2013 21:36 by Ultimate Seeker ™.
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Edward Snowden is an Inside Job 11 Jun 2013 21:44 #12

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I get what you mean, the 'terrorists have won' bit at the end came out because it means a lot to me;

maintaining what is right in the face of adversity because if you start to act like a terrorist to fight them you've lost.

it's very idealistic i know

The UK did it with the ira;

-stopped stress position/disorientating torture = good'
-internment = bad
-collusion with loyalists to systematically murder the command structure of the ira = bad

however the last point probably brought them quicker to the negotiating table as they quickly forgot a lot of their conditions when they realised they weren't too far down the list anymore

it doesn't make it right though

I suppose I'm trying to say it's sometimes it's not the result it's how you get there.
Last Edit: 11 Jun 2013 21:47 by username.
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Edward Snowden is an Inside Job 11 Jun 2013 21:54 #13

Things like the IRA only happen when governments, specifically conservative one's stop asking themselves whether what they are maintaining is actually "what is right"...When faced with such obstinacy as with the English occupation of Ireland, or the Apartheid government of South Africa and it's English supporters, people inevitably get tired of being ignored, cut out of the political discourse and marginalized, they inevitably find cathartic relief in extremist forms of opposition.

The very real question, and I think perhaps the US and UK should thank the Islamic Extremists for forcing them to ask it is; "Is what we're maintaining/doing/promoting actually right"...Now one could make a better point than this by highlighting Chomsky's analysis of the American treatment of the word Democracy in political/geostrategic discourse, the way they've consistantly in the past overthrown democratically elected governments to institute "democracy", I think Obama overall has shown he's willing to confront that big question.
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Last Edit: 11 Jun 2013 21:56 by Ultimate Seeker ™.
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Edward Snowden is an Inside Job 11 Jun 2013 22:05 #14

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The IRA is very complicated but you can't forget a lot of it was also to do with protection of black market trade too. Not all of them were for the cause. A lot of the bad things were done by the socialist government too. I think a lot of the problems about 'what is right' came in when Thatcher came in and people actually stopped asking the MI5, intelligence corps and attached SAS 'what are you actually doing?' ;)

Anyway, I just brought it up as an example as I've looked into it a bit.

I hope Obama does tackle that question. I'm watching him.

'people inevitably get tired of being ignored' just to quote you ultimate, bit like the EU :D sorry couldn't resist ;)

catch you later, have work to do
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Edward Snowden is an Inside Job 11 Jun 2013 22:14 #15

Hey Bud I don't take your point there about the EU, they give loons like Nigel Farage a platform afterall, can't say they don't allow all sorts of weirdos a platform to speak, some great young Politicians too though like Paul Murphy MEP.


Don't get me wrong about the EU, I'll alter my position on it from time to time, I wondered why you're anti-living between the UK Sweden and Denmark, surely having an EU passport is useful for that?
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Edward Snowden is an Inside Job 11 Jun 2013 22:41 #16

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hehe, i was just saying that sometimes people don't get asked about it. especially the UK. last time we got asked anything significant was 40 years ago or something. we're only allowed a referendum if we vote the walking penis back in :D

Even if the EU didn't exist Denmark and Sweden would still let me in because I'm amazing. If I stopped being amazing then I can marry Mrs Username (a Dane) and there's free movement for scandanavians within scandanavia (more so than EU movement) and their spouses (so long as you're ethnically european, unfortunately if i was like chinese or something they may start asking questions, marraige or not)

anyway, really going now :D. I have bad attention span and can't stop reading internet when writing
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Edward Snowden is an Inside Job 12 Jun 2013 16:28 #17

www.politico.com/story/2013/06/10-things-to-know-about-edward-snowden-92491.html#disqus_thread
By TAL KOPAN | 6/10/13 10:09 AM EDT Updated: 6/10/13 9:20 PM EDT
Edward Snowden burst in public view when the 29-year-old identified himself as the source of leaks about the National Security Agency’s surveillance of Americans. Here are 10 things to know about Snowden.

1. Doesn’t have a high school diploma. According to The Guardian, which published the first story about the NSA surveillance, Snowden never finished his high school coursework, taking classes at a community college in Maryland but not completing those, either. The paper reported he did obtain a GED later.

2. Donated to Ron Paul. Zeke Miller of Time reported that Snowden made two $250 donations to the libertarian presidential candidate’s 2012 campaign. Snowden told The Guardian he voted for a third party in 2008 rather than President Barack Obama.

3. Wasn’t a friendly neighbor. Snowden most recently lived in Hawaii with his girlfriend before leaving in early May, and neighbors say he didn’t stop to chat much. According to The Telegraph, a neighbor told a local television station: “We occasionally saw him as he was coming or going, or checking mail, or getting the garbage. We would say ‘Hi, how’s it going? How are you?’ and he would just rush inside.” Neighbors also said Snowden had boxes piled floor-to-ceiling in his garage for the entire six months he lived there.

(PHOTOS: Pols, pundits weigh in on NSA report)

4. His laptop stickers reveal his beliefs. Stickers on Snowden’s laptop express support for Internet freedom, The Guardian said. One reads, “I support Online Rights: Electronic Frontier Foundation,” and another is for the Tor Project, an online anonymity software.

5. Served in the Army for only five months. Snowden told The Guardian he enlisted in 2003 and entered a Special Forces training program but was discharged after breaking both his legs in a training accident. POLITICO confirmed Snowden was in the Army Reserve as a Special Forces recruit in 2004, but an Army spokesman said he was discharged five months later and “did not complete any training or receive any awards.”

6. First job with NSA was as a security guard. The Guardian reported that Snowden was a security guard at a covert NSA facility at the University of Maryland before moving on to the CIA to work on IT security.

(Also on POLITICO: Edward Snowden’s tricky path to justice)

7. Used the codename Verax, Latin for “truthteller.” According to Washington Post reporter Barton Gellman, Snowden picked the pseudonym for their interactions. He called Gellman BRASSBANNER.

8. Not on social media. Don’t bother looking for Snowden on Twitter or Facebook, Guardian reporter Glenn Greenwald says.

Any Twitter or Facebook accounts purporting to be Edward Snowden are fake.— Glenn Greenwald (@ggreenwald) June 9, 2013

9. Whereabouts are currently unknown. While Snowden had said he was staying in Hong Kong, Reuters and USA Today each spoke to a hotel in Hong Kong that said Snowden had been staying there but checked out of his room on Monday.

(See also: Full coverage of NSA phone tracking)

10. Lived comfortably. Snowden told The Guardian that he made about $200,000 a year in his position, which The New York Times reports may have been largely paid for by the U.S. government. Before he went into hiding, he was working for defense contractor Booz Allen Hamilton.
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Edward Snowden is an Inside Job 12 Jun 2013 16:51 #18

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Ultimate Seeker ™ wrote:
Organized Labor in the US got chucked in a river with concrete boots between 1930 and today, what you have today is the generations of the sixties entering politics, and their children entering politics over the next few decades meaning radical changes are afoot ;).

I agree with this because i see it going on in real life watching society change on the east coast from the 80's until now.

But in 2016 we will have to wait and see who will run for president and things could go south fast, literally...figuratively
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Edward Snowden is an Inside Job 13 Jun 2013 15:32 #19

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Edward Snowden is an Inside Job 13 Jun 2013 15:34 #20

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I bet FOX news would televise it if they were allowed

I still don't think he's a inside job, I think there's a good chance that he just did it out of conscience. Stranger things have happened!

The New York Times sat on the story for a year that it was happening under Bush, it didn't change under Obama, it got worse (server capabilities increase etc) so he made his move.

A counterpoint is that he was sucking up to the Chinese media today (or yesterday) that the USA was targetting China with surveillance, although if this is news to anyone they should get out more! So if he is anything that he doesn't appear to be I'm calling Chinese agent :D
Last Edit: 13 Jun 2013 15:39 by username.
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