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TOPIC: The Holocaust

The Holocaust 04 Aug 2014 09:49 #21

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Blue_Tackler wrote:
Witness testimony is permissible in a legal court, I think if a string of SS officers and engineers come out with testimony then it needs to be assessed as evidence.

Have you any evidence to supply that these people were tortured for their evidence or that they later retracted their evidence?

I'm willing to believe that people would make false testimony under duress but in such cases the duress is later exposed.
So have you anything to back up the duress that you say (torture) that occurred, if not then surely that accusation is non-permissible.

You don't have lawful courts, we got jewish inquisition courts, who reject physical evidence that the jews lie.
Dangerous topic for you, I will show you what is practice in "court".

Physical and forensic evidence trumps any testimony, a lawful court will always first look into forensic evidence. Always.

Are you familiar with the two Zündel trials in Toronto?

Let's summarize, you haven't answered any question yet, but you go on in typical jewish manner with repetition as you were tasked to do.
The resident shill announced
blue_tackler wrote:
please make my profile inactive, I no longer want to have any connection to this forum.

yet he is trolling further. :facepalm:

blue_tackler wrote:
the lice are only going to jump onto other typhus victim

Prime example of holocaustianity mental issues, clinically insane, and utterly ill informed, a danger to public health if this dude was working for CDC.
Last Edit: 04 Aug 2014 09:50 by Oracle.
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The Holocaust 04 Aug 2014 09:50 #22

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BTW franz suchomel gave his 'video' evidence after his conviction was spent afaik.
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The Holocaust 04 Aug 2014 09:51 #23

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Evidence that Treblinka was not a Death Camp

trutube.tv/video/23849/The-Treblinka-Archaeology-Hoax

cant get this video on yt now - the jewish power had it removed - alleging copyright violations

so hence you need to go to tru tube to see it

It is a debunking of the archaeologist Caroline Sturdy Colls' claims that she has found evidence of mas graves etc at Treblinka.


Truth is anti-semitic
Last Edit: 04 Aug 2014 10:04 by Voltaire. Reason: spelling
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The Holocaust 04 Aug 2014 09:51 #24

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Blue_Tackler wrote:
BTW franz suchomel gave his 'video' evidence after his conviction was spent afaik.

Why are there thought crime laws persecuting doubters with 3+ years in prison?

The resident shill announced
blue_tackler wrote:
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yet he is trolling further. :facepalm:

blue_tackler wrote:
the lice are only going to jump onto other typhus victim

Prime example of holocaustianity mental issues, clinically insane, and utterly ill informed, a danger to public health if this dude was working for CDC.
Last Edit: 04 Aug 2014 09:53 by Oracle.
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The Holocaust 04 Aug 2014 09:57 #25

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Are you familiar with the two Zündel trials in Toronto?

I can't say that I am but I'd rather not drift from the topic of Treblinka.

There are an amount of photographs of excavations taking place, and evidence of at least one dig, and testimony of others.
holocaust-history.org/Treblinka/appendixd/
We also have the latest from Forensic archaeologist Caroline Sturdy Colls using the ground penetrating radar.
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The Holocaust 04 Aug 2014 09:59 #26

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Blue_Tackler wrote:
Are you familiar with the two Zündel trials in Toronto?

I can't say that I am but I'd rather not drift from the topic of Treblinka.

How can you say you are not familiar with the Toronto trials, but stating you don't want to drift from the topic?
You don't know what Toronto was all about, right?
What a joke you are, you know exactly that Toronto is dangerous waters for you goons.

Are you a jew, Vegan?

Why do you need thought crime laws to protect the ridiculous science defying narrative?

Why don't the jews want anybody to dig?
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blue_tackler wrote:
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yet he is trolling further. :facepalm:

blue_tackler wrote:
the lice are only going to jump onto other typhus victim

Prime example of holocaustianity mental issues, clinically insane, and utterly ill informed, a danger to public health if this dude was working for CDC.
Last Edit: 04 Aug 2014 10:03 by Oracle.
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The Holocaust 04 Aug 2014 10:13 #27

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Voltaire wrote:
Evidence that Treblinka was not a Death Camp

trutube.tv/video/23849/The-Treblinka-Archaeology-Hoax

cant get this video on yt now - the jewish power had it removed - alleging copyright violations

so hence you need to go to tru tube to see it

It is a debunking of the archaeologist Caroline Sturdy Colls' claims that she has found evidence of mas graves etc at Treblinka.

it's not rely much of a debunking it's more like a denial that what Caroline Collls uncovered.
The point being missed is that 'if' and I do mean 'if' Caroline's discoveries are wrong, for whatever reason, the question then is, why would the buildings be bull dozed if there was nothing to hide?

I really think if all these SS testimonies were faked and given under duress then by now perhaps even much later in their lives they would have exposed this duress themselves, no?
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Last Edit: 04 Aug 2014 10:23 by Frothy.
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The Holocaust 04 Aug 2014 10:18 #28

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Blue_Tackler wrote:
Voltaire wrote:
Evidence that Treblinka was not a Death Camp

trutube.tv/video/23849/The-Treblinka-Archaeology-Hoax

cant get this video on yt now - the jewish power had it removed - alleging copyright violations

so hence you need to go to tru tube to see it

It is a debunking of the archaeologist Caroline Sturdy Colls' claims that she has found evidence of mas graves etc at Treblinka.

it's not rely much of a debunking it's more like a denial that what Caroline Collls uncovered.
The point being missed is that 'if' and I do mean 'if' Caroline's discoveries are wrong, for whatever reason, the question then is, why would the buildings be bull dozed if their was nothing to hide?

I really think if all these SS testimonies were faked at land given under duress then by now perhaps even much later in their lives they would have exposed this duress themselves, no?

Why are there thought crime laws in place persecuting any doubters of your claims? Why do "courts" handle the "holocaust" as "manifest obvious" while rejecting any evidence of the defence of an accused "denier"?

Answer please, as it answers your stupid deflecting question. I will bug you with this as long as necessary, until you either answered or you let your shill thread die.


Sylvia Stolz is a German lawyer who was put into prison (for a total of three and a half years !!), just for the fact of presenting official evidence during the court case (in 2007) for the defense of her client, the legendary "Holocaust denier".., Ernst Zundel.

Here she tells her story at the AZK (Anti Censorship Coalition) conference in Switzerland in November 2012.

In 2008, she was banned from speaking during the trial, barred from presenting evidence, and criminally charged with "contempt of court", and with "inciting contempt".., and charged under the same section of the German Criminal Code as her client, Ernst Zundel.

She is now also barred from practicing law. And now after giving this presentation in Switzerland, she is now AGAIN facing criminal charges, as is the host and organizer of the AZK.., Mr. Ivo Sasek

As I always ask.., after watching this very well spoken speech.., do your best to then PASS IT ON.., in whatever way possible...
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blue_tackler wrote:
please make my profile inactive, I no longer want to have any connection to this forum.

yet he is trolling further. :facepalm:

blue_tackler wrote:
the lice are only going to jump onto other typhus victim

Prime example of holocaustianity mental issues, clinically insane, and utterly ill informed, a danger to public health if this dude was working for CDC.
Last Edit: 04 Aug 2014 10:21 by Oracle.
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The Holocaust 04 Aug 2014 10:21 #29

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Oracle wrote:
Blue_Tackler wrote:
Are you familiar with the two Zündel trials in Toronto?

I can't say that I am but I'd rather not drift from the topic of Treblinka.

How can you say you are not familiar with the Toronto trials, but stating you don't want to drift from the topic?
You don't know what Toronto was all about, right?
What a joke you are, you know exactly that Toronto is dangerous waters for you goons.

Are you a jew, Vegan?

Why do you need thought crime laws to protect the ridiculous science defying narrative?

Why don't the jews want anybody to dig?
You posted Zünde trials (of which I can't say I'm familiar and have no link to it relating specifically to Treblinka.

Afaik Jews religion etc.. stops them from digging, although I would have suspected that they could have made an exception for Treblinka and I have wondered about this.
Just remind me why do you think franz suchomel is giving false testimony, I mean he's going into some particular detail, perhaps he's a trained actor?
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The Holocaust 04 Aug 2014 10:24 #30

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Blue_Tackler wrote:
Oracle wrote:
Blue_Tackler wrote:
Are you familiar with the two Zündel trials in Toronto?

I can't say that I am but I'd rather not drift from the topic of Treblinka.

How can you say you are not familiar with the Toronto trials, but stating you don't want to drift from the topic?
You don't know what Toronto was all about, right?
What a joke you are, you know exactly that Toronto is dangerous waters for you goons.

Are you a jew, Vegan?

Why do you need thought crime laws to protect the ridiculous science defying narrative?

Why don't the jews want anybody to dig?
You posted Zünde trials (of which I can't say I'm familiar and have no link to it relating specifically to Treblinka.

Afaik Jews religion etc.. stops them from digging, although I would have suspected that they could have made an exception for Treblinka and I have wondered about this.
Just remind me why do you think franz suchomel is giving false testimony, I mean he's going into some particular detail, perhaps he's a trained actor?

He is an actor, as countless other jew "survivors". Some were born after 1945 even.

The resident shill announced
blue_tackler wrote:
please make my profile inactive, I no longer want to have any connection to this forum.

yet he is trolling further. :facepalm:

blue_tackler wrote:
the lice are only going to jump onto other typhus victim

Prime example of holocaustianity mental issues, clinically insane, and utterly ill informed, a danger to public health if this dude was working for CDC.
Last Edit: 04 Aug 2014 10:37 by Oracle.
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The Holocaust 04 Aug 2014 10:32 #31

I can't believe there's people who call themselves ''truthers'' or ''researchers'', or whatever they call themselves that still believe in the so called holocaust. Anybody who's done more than 10 mins of serious research will tell be able to tell you that Treblinka was a transit camp and not a death camp as claimed by Jewish atrocity propaganda sources. The holocaust as told by the mass media has now been thoroughly debunked over and over. Anybody who takes the time to do the proper research will come to the same conclusion. That being there is no evidence of any extermination program or gassings. The people who died in the camps died of disease or malnutrition, which to a large extent was due to the intensive Allied bombing campaign against Germany. Ironic really that the so called liberators were the cause of so many deaths.


Treblinka detention centre

The Treblinka detention centre (KL TREBLINKA) was a transit camp with the aim of the resettlement of Jews with priority from the area Poland see within the scope of final solution of the Jew's question. After the Madagascar plan could not be carried out on grounds of the English refusal of a peace agreement, the Jews should be resettled on the occupied east areas.

The dentention centre camp and transit camp in Treblinka existed approx. during 1 year from middle of 1942 till the end of 1943. It was after official historiography part of the so-called action Reinhardt. After the war the Allies and Polish government claimed Treblinka was an "extermination camp" where the Germans used "gas chambers" to kill one million Jews. The "German Historical Museum" claimed, "At the beginning of October 1942 the new commander Franz Stangl constructed ten new gas chambers for 4.000 jews."

On the 15th of November, 1942 the terrorist underground movement Warsaw ghetto published a report in which she stated, from end of July till the beginning of November two million Jews were exterminated in the transit camp Treblinka in steam chambers (sic!) (within three months!). en.metapedia.org/wiki/Treblinka_detention_centre

Treblinka was such a non-issue that the 1965 World Book Encyclopedia Has no entry for it!

Then Jewish propaganda took hold

Treblinka was a work and transit camp used temporarily to house prisoners on their way to other camps in the German system. It was located 62 miles northeast of Warsaw. The buildings included barracks, bakery and storage buildings.

Treblinka was made up of two separate camps. Treblinka I was a penal work camp that wasn't at all secret. The 1941 directive announcing the establishment of the "Treblinka Labor Camp" was published in both Polish and German in widely distributed official journals. Poles and Jews worked in a large sand and gravel quarry at the Treblinka labor camp.

Treblinka II, the so-called "extermination" camp, was located about a mile and a half UP from the rail spur from Treblinka I. As wartime aerial reconnaissance photographs clearly show, Treblinka I was at the end of the rail spur on which Treblinka II was also located. This fact strengthens the thesis that the Treblinka II camp was not particularly secret, since penal labor prisoners being taken by train to and from the publicly known Treblinka I camp passed directly by the supposedly top secret Treblinka II "extermination" camp.

So what was Treblinka II? Simply a transit camp for prisoners going to others areas.

Most prisoners of Treblinka came from the Warsaw Ghetto from July to October, 1942. Others came after the Warsaw Ghetto uprising in may of 1943. www.saveyourheritage.com/treblinka.htm
The object of life is not to be on the side of the majority, but to escape finding oneself in the ranks of the insane. – Marcus Aurelius
Last Edit: 04 Aug 2014 10:39 by Return of Zorro.
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The Holocaust 04 Aug 2014 10:39 #32

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Sturdy Colls: Well the survey results when corroborated with historical information have indicated that there are a number of surviving building foundations at Treblinka just below the surface and also a considerable amount of obviously structural debris which the Nazis would have been simply unable to have removed from the site, and this supports accounts written by post-war investigators which commented upon the visibility of artefactual remains, structural remains, at the camp. We’ve also identified a number of pits at the site. Again, all these pits have been mapped and corroborated with witness plans and this is indicative of a number of probable graves at the site. It is recognised as part of the survey that the history of Treblinka didn’t end with its abandonment by the Nazis. Issues such as post-war looting and the construction of the memorial itself and a number of other forms of landscape change that have taken place at the site, you know, could confuse interpretation so it was essential that all of these were considered when the results from the geophysical survey in particular were being assessed. So then all of this data was married up with historical information so we seem to have a situation here where it’s been commonly believed that all of the victims at Treblinka were cremated, they were destroyed without trace, however, the research has revealed a much more complex picture of the disposal patterns used by the Nazis. Looking at it from an offender profiling perspective, so a slightly more forensic point of view, the Nazis worked on, as do most offenders, this principle of least effort where they would actually have a burial method that very much matched the nature of their victims or their locations within the camp and there are a number of photographs and physical evidence that we observed on the ground at Treblinka that demonstrates that these bodies were not reduced to ash, that some survive as mass graves in the truest sense and that also the ashes of the victims were redeposited into the pits that they were originally exhumed from upon Himmler’s order in 1943. Also with the topographic survey we’ve demonstrated that the camp as it’s marked currently on the ground by the modern memorial was actually much larger, that the boundaries of the camp should have been 50 metres further north and this has a knock-on effect for a number of structures within the camp itself. So we can examine it from a spatial point of view and look at all of these features in relation to each other and hopefully eventually start to build up a more detailed map of the camp as it existed during its operation.

Interviewer: So you’ve now presented your findings to the authorities responsible for the memorial at Treblinka. Does this conclude investigations at the Treblinka site or is it sort of an ongoing project?

Sturdy Colls: It’s absolutely an ongoing project. The survey demonstrated that the site has got huge potential in terms of what we can learn from the application of archaeological method and very much was the tip of the iceberg in terms of being the first survey of what I hope will be many more to come. I hope to return to the site later on this year and there will be subsequent seasons of fieldwork in coming years. As I mentioned, at the moment what we’ve got is a map of what survived at the camp as a result of my findings. However, in order to build up a map of the camp as it existed we need to do more work, we need to survey the site. Only a small proportion of the site has actually been surveyed so there’s huge potential to find out more about the history of this camp in the future."

Somewhat more on the findings of Sturdy Colls could be gleaned from the BBC 4 radio documentary "Hidden Graves of the Holocaust." Starting at the mark 23:20 minutes we hear:


"Caroline Sturdy Colls: All the history books states that Treblinka was destroyed by the Nazis, in summary, the survey demonstrated that this simply isn’t the case. I have identified a number of buried [sic] pits using geophysical techniques. These are considerable. One in particular is 26 meters by 17 meters.

Jonathan Charles: That’s huge.

Sturdy Colls: It is huge. We are talking about a considerable number of bodies [which] could have been contained within pits of that size.

Charles: That could have contained hundreds, perhaps thousands of bodies, we don’t know how deep it is, or do you know how deep it is?

Sturdy Colls: Unfortunately no. The survey technology does not allow us to go to certain depths. I know that it is over 4 meters, that was the extent of this [inaudible]. It’s a considerable pit.

Charles: There are quite a few pits that you have discovered?

Sturdy Colls: Absolutely, there were a number of pits, in particular to the rear of what of what is now the current memorial, five that are actually in a row, again of a considerable size, in an area where witnesses state this was the main body
disposal area, this is behind the gas chambers, it was where the majority of victims who were sent there were then subsequently buried, and later where the cremative remains of the victims were also placed.

Charles: It’s not just pits that you found, there’s also what look like buildings.

Sturdy Colls: There are, and again, the Nazis claimed they destroyed Treblinka, they certainly levelled the site, but it’s not really possible when buildings have been on a site to actually sterilize the ground, so what I’ve identified is that solid structural remains, we’re talking building foundations, do survive, but in particular two sort of structures that I’ve identified are likely to be the old and new gas chambers at Treblinka."

While here we learn virtually nothing about the supposed remains of the Treblinka "gas chambers," we are provided with some tantalizing information on the camp’s burial pits. Needless to say, a critical assessment of the findings made by Sturdy Colls can only be made after she has published at least a preliminary report or a detailed article on the same, but we may nonetheless with appropriate caution note down some preliminary observations on what has been revealed so far. The most interesting information, however, is not to be found in the radio interviews, but in a short article by Sturdy Colls herself which was published on the website of the BBC on 23 January.[5] In this we read:


"The existence of mass graves was known about from witness testimony, but the failure to provide persuasive physical evidence led some to question whether it could really be true that hundreds of thousands of Jews were killed here.

Although they lasted only a few days, those post-war investigations [in 1945-1946] remained the most complete studies of the camp until I began my work at Treblinka in 2010.

This revealed the existence of a number of pits across the site.

Some may be the result of post-war looting, prompted by myths of buried Jewish gold, but several larger pits were recorded in areas suggested by witnesses as the locations of mass graves and cremation sites.

One is 26m long, 17m wide and at least four metres deep, with a ramp at the west end and a vertical edge to the east.

Another five pits of varying sizes and also at least this deep are located nearby. Given their size and location, there is a strong case for arguing that they represent burial areas. [...]

As well as the pits, the survey has located features that appear to be structural, and two of these are likely to be the remains of the gas chambers.

According to witnesses, these were the only structures in the death camp made of brick."

The information furnished by the two interviews, the article and the maps allow us to make the following observations:
1.The pit which Sturdy Colls mentions "in particular" and which is stated to have a surface area of "26 meters by 17 meters," that is a total of 442 square meters, is, judging by the dimensions, most likely identical with the rather irregular pit #3, located some 25 m south of the large cenotaph. This is clearly the largest in surface of the 10 pits identified.
2. As far as the surface area is concerned, two of the 33 mass graves identified by Andrzej Kola at Belzec (pits #1 and 27) were larger (with 480 and 540 square meters respectively), whereas two more (#7 and 14) were almost of the same size (364.5 and 370 square meters respectively).[6] Of the six burial pits identified by Kola at Sobibór, two (pit #2 and 4) were larger or even significantly larger (with surface areas of 500 and 1,575 square meters respectively), whereas two other graves were nearly of the same surface size (pits #1 and 6, with 400 and 375 square meters respectively).[7] Yet whereas at Belzec some 435,000 and at Sobibór some 80,000 corpses are alleged to have been interred,[8] the number of uncremated bodies buried at Treblinka is supposed to have amounted to at least some 700,000. Would it then not make sense for the Germans to use mass graves of a larger size at Treblinka than at the other two Reinhardt camps?
J. Graf, C. Mattogno: Treblinka

For details about the alleged
extermination camp
at Treblinka see:
J. Graf, C. Mattogno:
Treblinka: Transit Camp
or Extermination Camp?
$30.- from The Barnes Review


3.The eyewitnesses Eliahu Rosenberg and Chil Rajchman, who to the knowledge of this author are the only witnesses to have provided detailed statements on the dimensions of the mass graves in the "death camp proper," claim pits of sizes vastly larger than the largest pit mapped by Sturdy Colls. Eliahu Rosenberg claimed in 1947 that the mass graves measured 120 m × 15 m × 6 m, giving a surface area of 1,800 square meters and a total volume 9,900 cubic meters.[9] Chil Rajchman, whose 1944 testimony[10] is prominently featured in the "Hidden Graves of the Holocaust" radio program – including a particularly bizarre passage from it concerning burning blood – states:[11]

"The pits were enormous, about 50 metres long, about 30 wide and several storeys deep. I estimate that the pits could contain about four storeys."

The burial pits thus measured 1,500 square meters according to the witness Rajchman and maybe as much as (1,500 × 12 =) 18,000 cubic meters in volume! How come that the largest of the pits discovered by Sturdy Colls corresponds to less than one third of the surface size claimed by Rajchman and to one fourth of the surface area claimed by Rosenberg?


4.It is indeed unfortunate that the top modern equipment used by Sturdy Colls for some reason or other was not able to detect depths exceeding 4 meters. Perhaps it would have been wise of her to dispense of some of the piety with regards to "Jewish burial laws" and utilize probe drillings to measure the depth of the pits, as was done by Kola at both Belzec and Sobibór. Of the pits identified by Kola in these two camps, the deepest pit (#3 at Sobibór) measured 5.80 m, whereas the depth of the remaining pits averaged some 4 m.

Generously assuming Rosenberg’s estimate of 6 meters (Rajchman’s estimate of some 12 meters can be safely dismissed as an exaggeration), and even more generously assuming (for the sake of argument) 6 meters to be the effective depth, with the pit walls being vertical instead of sloping (an obviously unrealistic assumption, which is moreover contradicted by Sturdy Colls statement that this pit had a "ramp" at the west end and a "vertical edge to the east," implying that three out of four side walls were oblique – but again, for the sake of argument…) pit #3 would have a volume of (26 × 17 × 6 =) 2,652 cubic meters. Assuming an average capacity of 8 corpses per cubic meters,[12] this means that the pit in question could have contained in total (2,652 × 8 =) 21,216 corpses. Since the so-called Höfle document from an exterminationist viewpoint shows that nearly 713,555 were murdered at Treblinka up until the end of 1942 – in reality this document only proves that this number of Jews was deported to the camp up until that time – and since virtually all sources maintain that non-experimental cremations on a significant scale did not commence at Treblinka until 1943, at least 700,000 corpses would have had to have been interred in the camp, necessitating no less than (700,000/21,216 =) 33 pits of the same size as pit #3, with a total surface area of 14,586 square meter, or nearly 1.5 hectares. Needless to say the mass graves would have had to be separated by soil walls of considerable thickness, thereby increasing the surface area required by the graves.



Above: Montage of the 10 identified pits placed within a square 100 × 100 meters. Relative dimensions have been kept unchanged from the maps produced by Caroline Sturdy Colls.

5.Pits #1 and 2, which together appear to have a surface area of some 600-700 square meters, are located in the western part of the camp site, near the torn-up railroad sidespur, clearly outside of the "death camp proper." These may be identical with the mass graves mentioned by the witness Abraham Kszepicki, in which the bodies of Jews who had died en route to the camp were buried during the first months of operation.[13]
6.The four pits #5-8 are placed in a (not very straight) row. Sturdy Colls states in the radio documentary that there are "five" pits of "considerable size" "in a row" and in the area which witnesses state "was the main body disposal area, [...] behind the gas chambers." Either Sturdy Colls mistakenly said five when she meant four, or maybe she counted one of the other pits, perhaps #6, with its "neck" in the middle, as two separate pits. Regardless of which, it is clear that the pits #5-8 cover a surface area which corresponds to roughly 175-200% that of #3, that is, somewhere in the range of 750-900 square meters.
7. Altogether, pits #3-10 as mapped by Sturdy Colls cover a surface hardly exceeding 1,800 square meters. If we assume, again for the sake of argument, the no doubt overly generous average effective depth of 6 meters with vertical pit walls – and once more I want to remind my readers that the pits identified at Belzec and Sobibór averaged some 4 m in depth – this would mean that the "probable burial/cremation pits" in the "death camp proper"/"upper camp"/"camp 2"[14] had a total volume of some (1,800 × 6 =) 10,800 cubic meters. The pits at Belzec as identified by Kola have a total estimated volume of 21,310 cubic meters,[15] whereas those at Sobibór have a total estimated volume of 14,718 cubic meters.[16] The no doubt greatly exaggerated estimate of 10,800 cubic meters could have contained at most some (10,800 × 8 =) 86,400 corpses (assuming instead a more realistic average effective depth of 5 m this figure would change to 72,000 – and this still disregards the likely enlargement of the original grave volumes due to clandestine diggings and other causes). According to Yitzhak Arad, some 312,500 Jews were murdered in Treblinka merely "during the first five weeks of the killing operation."[17] According to the files of the Jewish Council in Warsaw, 251,545 Jews from the ghetto in that city were deported to Treblinka between 22 July 1942 and 12 September 1942.[18] And as already mentioned, the Höfle document states that 713,555 were deported to Treblinka up until the end of 1942. Judging by the information revealed, only a small fraction of this enormous number of people could have been buried in the identified "probable burial/cremation pits," even taking into account the two pits in the reception camp, which, given the reported structure of the camp, could not have been used for any hypothetical "gas chamber" victims.
8. Sturdy Colls’s statement that "the failure to provide persuasive physical evidence [of mass graves] led some to question whether it could really be true that hundreds of thousands of Jews were killed here" implies that the presence of mass graves itself would be enough to refute the "deniers." However, it is clear that mass graves of considerable size must have existed at Treblinka, even if it was in fact only a transit camp. Holocaust historian Dieter Pohl estimates that up to 5 % of the deportees to the Reinhardt camps perished en route due to suffocation, dehydration, crushing caused by panicking deportees etc.[19] Considering that the reception of transports at Treblinka during the intense initial months of operation is claimed to have been grossly mismanaged by the first camp commandant, Dr. Irmfried Eberl (who, apparently because of this reason, was fired and replaced by Franz Stangl), which led to the delay of transports at way stations[20] – and this in the summer heat of July and August – there is little reason to doubt this estimate with regard to Treblinka. Since some 800,000 Jews in total were deported to Treblinka during the camp’s period of operation (July 1942 – August 1943), this would mean a total of some 40,000 en route deaths. Moreover, there are reasons to assume that a smaller percentage of the deportees were subjected to "euthanasia" due to contagious or mental diseases, or for being too weak for further transport. To this should be added a smaller number of deaths among the camp inmates caused by epidemics etc., as well as those killed by guards in connection with attempts at escape or uprisings.
9. The vague mention of a "more complex picture of the disposal patterns used by the Nazis" is interesting. Were uncremated corpses also detected by the survey, and if so, how many?
10.Sturdy Colls labeled the pits "probable burial/cremation pits," indicating that one or more of the pits may have been used for cremations and not for interment (at Sobibór Kola identified such a pit with an area of 10 × 3 m and a depth of up to 90 cm). In this context the smaller, more rectangular pits #4 and 5 may be the most likely candidates. The dimensions of an identified cremation pit could give important hints about the actual cremation capacity at Treblinka.
11. It is noteworthy that none of the pits or structural remains are located under the stone/concrete covered memorial areas (cf. the map to the left, where these areas are visible as a bluish gray). Sturdy Colls did not mention whether or not she was able to map these area with her geophysics equipment.[21] This issue, like many others, will have to await further clarification. The covered area inside the "death camp proper" appears to correspond to roughly 1 hectare.

12.It may be worth making a quick comparison of the maps furnished by Sturdy Colls with the "reconstruction" of Treblinka proposed by exterminationist air-photo analyst Alex Bay.[22] Concerning the mass graves Bay writes:[23]


"Unfortunately, the aerial photography does not contain enough information to delineate the boundaries of the graves. The May [1944] coverage is sufficient only for crudely identifying the places where deep disturbances in general are probable, but the exact boundaries cannot be established.

In Figure 42 aerial photography is presented in which nine 50 by 25 meter [164 × 82 feet] pits have been drawn to scale along the east and west sides. The positioning and size of these pits is purely speculative."

The dimensions of 50 × 25 m for the pits are taken from Bay’s number one eyewitness, Yankiel Wiernik, and his 1944 publication A Year in Treblinka. Wiernik writes indeed that "The dimensions of each ditch were 50 by 25 by 10 meters"[24] but this almost certainly refers to ditches located not in the "death camp proper," but in the reception camp. The scene wherein Wiernik provides the above-mentioned dimensions takes place on the second day after his arrival in the camp, and the following chapters imply that he first visited the "death camp proper" or Camp II, as he calls it, only several days later.



Location of alleged gas chamber building according to Bay and Sturdy Colls.
(click on the picture to view it in full size)

In the figure to the right I have placed Bay’s Figure 42 side by side with the Sturdy Colls composite map based on the 1944 air photo. (Click on it to open a full-size version.) The scales of the two maps have been harmonized. To Bay’s map I have also added the letters A and B to indicate the solid black outlines drawn by Bay to mark out the two alleged gas chamber buildings. Even considering Bay’s admission that the positioning and size of his mass graves "is purely speculative," it is clear that his vision of what the "death camp proper" might have looked like differs considerably from Sturdy Colls’ map. As for the locations of the two alleged gas chamber buildings, which Bay goes to painstaking length to identify (based on the aerial photos and witness statements), the four structures marked out by Sturdy Colls (in blue) and designated "probable location of gas chambers" are located some 100 m south of the sites pinpointed by Bay. The alignment of these structures is also rather different from that asserted by Bay. Together with the considerable difference in surface size between the mass graves posited by Bay and the pits identified by Sturdy Colls, this says something of the competence of Bay as well as the reliability of his star witness Wiernik.

13. As for the "probable location of gas chambers" we learn virtually nothing other than that Sturdy Colls has identified two brick structures. On the composite maps, however, four structures are marked out, of which the largest (near the eastern exit of the "Road to heaven") is likely to be the one identified by Sturdy Colls as the "new gas chamber building." The three other structures, two of which are relatively large, are located close to each other. One must suppose that one of the two larger structures has been identified by Sturdy Colls as the "old gas chamber building." According to the most elaborate exterminationist effort to map Treblinka based on aerial photos and eyewitness testimony – the 2004 map by Peter Laponder (who also refers to ground photos taken inside the "death camp proper" as found in Kurt Franz’s photo album "Schöne Zeiten")[25] – the only structures located adjacent to the "old gas chamber building" were a water pump shelter, a tiny guardhouse, and a watchtower. Yet on the composite map we have two larger structures next to each other. We will have to wait and see if the geophysical survey has revealed anything about the layout of these structures. If that is not the case, we can only hope that Sturdy Colls soon returns to the camp site to excavate the detected structural remains.

All in all, the information revealed by these interviews about the findings of the 2011 geophysical survey at Treblinka provides us with more questions than answers. We can only wait and hope that a preliminary report on the research results is not too long in coming. One thing is sure, however, namely that little indicates that the findings of Caroline Sturdy Colls have actually "proven Holocaust deniers wrong" with regard to Treblinka. On the contrary: the information revealed seems to hint that the findings of Caroline Sturdy Colls may well spell doom for the official historiography on Treblinka.

barnesreview.org/wp/archives/253
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The Holocaust 04 Aug 2014 10:41 #33

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So you saying that
He is an actor, as countless other jew "survivors". Some were born after 1945 even.

But you have no evidence rather than you don't agree with what he says.
Or do you?
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The Holocaust 04 Aug 2014 10:41 #34

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Zorro wrote:
I can't believe there's people who call themselves ''truthers'' or ''researchers'', or whatever they call themselves that still believe in the so called holocaust. Anybody who's done more than 10 mins of serious research will tell be able to tell you that Treblinka was a transit camp and not a death camp as claimed by Jewish atrocity propaganda sources. The holocaust as told by the mass media has now been thoroughly debunked over and over. Anybody who takes the time to do the proper research will come to the same conclusion. That being there is no evidence of any extermination program or gassings. The people who died in the camps died of disease or malnutrition.

Read the comments, I am pleased the fight for truth has been taken to the enemy's doorstep.

blog.adl.org/anti-semitism/the-jewish-gas-chamber-hoax-holocaust-denial-eric-hunt
Storm

It’s get­tin sweaty now huh? The dirty past com­ing back to hunt you . And it wor­ries you . Soon every­body will know , it was noth­ing but a lie.
Anon

The truth doesn’t fear inves­ti­ga­tion. Amaz­ing how Jews lobied in so many dif­fer­ent nations to have ques­tion­ing the holo­caust, or hav­ing a dif­fer­ent opin­ion made illegal.

All this pro­pa­ganda and ad-hominem attacks “stop the haters!!” “ignore them they are crazy!! haters they must be stopped!! ban them for voic­ing an opin­ion, their opin­ions are dangerous!!”

Not to men­tion bil­lions of dol­lars worth of US Tax Payer’s hard earned money goes to the Jew­ish only state each year. Biggest par­a­site in human history.
Andreas Meyer

I’ve seen it, the movie is quite good. I espe­cially liked the part about the peo­ple that went to Tre­blinka and were send to other places from there!
Beloved Ger­man

All the Semi­tism and for what. Please stop wor­ship­ping the Golden calf. Jews take a dive off of your ivory tower. Some of us will catch you. Just admit that you have been deceived by your false prophets.

:clap:
The resident shill announced
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please make my profile inactive, I no longer want to have any connection to this forum.

yet he is trolling further. :facepalm:

blue_tackler wrote:
the lice are only going to jump onto other typhus victim

Prime example of holocaustianity mental issues, clinically insane, and utterly ill informed, a danger to public health if this dude was working for CDC.
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The Holocaust 04 Aug 2014 10:45 #35

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Comments Closed - case closed (well not really but the irony is palpable) :larf:


Truth is anti-semitic
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The Holocaust 04 Aug 2014 10:47 #36

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Blue_Tackler wrote:
So you saying that
He is an actor, as countless other jew "survivors". Some were born after 1945 even.

But you have no evidence rather than you don't agree with what he says.
Or do you?

Your claim of some "gassing", hence the burden of proof is on you. I don't claim jews were gassed deliberately by plan, you do.
Thus I asked you already how it technically worked, no matter what jew actors "testfied".

So let's dig at Treblinka, yes?
The resident shill announced
blue_tackler wrote:
please make my profile inactive, I no longer want to have any connection to this forum.

yet he is trolling further. :facepalm:

blue_tackler wrote:
the lice are only going to jump onto other typhus victim

Prime example of holocaustianity mental issues, clinically insane, and utterly ill informed, a danger to public health if this dude was working for CDC.
Last Edit: 04 Aug 2014 10:49 by Oracle.
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The Holocaust 04 Aug 2014 11:15 #37

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Oracle wrote:
Blue_Tackler wrote:
So you saying that
He is an actor, as countless other jew "survivors". Some were born after 1945 even.

But you have no evidence rather than you don't agree with what he says.
Or do you?

Your claim of some "gassing", hence the burden of proof is on you. I don't claim jews were gassed deliberately by plan, you do.
Thus I asked you already how it technically worked, no matter what jew actors "testfied".

So let's dig at Treblinka, yes?

I don't claim anything about Treblinka I merely posted some evidence by SS personnel claiming that gassing took place.
And as I say if they were giving evidence under duress why have none of them ever changed their statements ?
Or have they?
I don't know how it technically worked, if your asking about how the gas chambers were operated it's in some of the testimonies. They seem to say that there was a motor or something driving the gas?

You appear to be suggesting that I've somehow gathered all this information from actors, liars and duress, if that's the case surely at least one of them would have blown the wihistle?
That's the problem, these witnesses are credible because they appear to be saying the same thing, they were there, this is evidence that they gave at their trials, I wonder if there are any Treblinka employees with statements that said no gas chambers existed there?
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Last Edit: 04 Aug 2014 11:20 by Frothy.
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The Holocaust 04 Aug 2014 11:34 #38

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Blue_Tackler wrote:

You appear to be suggesting that I've somehow gathered all this information from actors, liars and duress, if that's the case surely at least one of them would have blown the wihistle?

Why is there a persecution of anyone who doubts your claims you dub "evidence"? Why 3.5 years for doubting this nonsense? If there was some physical evidence, they wouldn't need thought crime laws. Agreed?

Let's dig at Treblinka, agreed? You got nothing to fear what they'll find. Right?

Watch this lecture, you naive shill. :chuckle:


Btw, you won't succeed with your silly questions, it is your duty to also read other sources than official "holocaust"(tm) sources. I know the truth, you peddle the lies, and you make look yourself utterly uneducated.

Leave aside that American "holocaust" fairy tales differ from Soviet "holocaust" fairy tales.
You are simply no match here.
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yet he is trolling further. :facepalm:

blue_tackler wrote:
the lice are only going to jump onto other typhus victim

Prime example of holocaustianity mental issues, clinically insane, and utterly ill informed, a danger to public health if this dude was working for CDC.
Last Edit: 04 Aug 2014 11:40 by Oracle.
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The Holocaust 04 Aug 2014 11:40 #39

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The gas chamber at Mauthausen had tiled walls

Not that that proves there was gas in Treblinka but we know that the gas chambers were tiled
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The Holocaust 04 Aug 2014 11:45 #40

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For what it's worth I'd be for a dig a Treblinka.
Problem you have here is that these testimonies that you say are false or given under duress, surely by the time all the witness under duress would have died, they would have put the record straight.
Don't you think?
Why is there a persecution of anyone who doubts your claims you dub "evidence"?
So how are you being persecuted ? :facepalm:
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