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TOPIC: The Holocaust

The Holocaust 28 Jul 2019 19:53 #3441

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Anyway, it's all been said, maybe I'll post again on the thread if anything new is revealed.
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The Holocaust 28 Jul 2019 20:03 #3442

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If the SS were mandated from on high to intentionally mass exterminate Jews/prisoners why were there SS officers who were running labor camps who were charged by the SS for mistreating their prisoners, such as Amon Goth for example (of Schindler's List fame), who was relieved of his duties and charged by the SS for stealing Jewish property, failing to provide adequate food to the prisoners under his charge, violating labor camp regulations regarding the treatment and punishment of prisoners and allowing unauthorized access to camp personnel records.

There is documentation of this and elsewhere when SS members were breaking regulations regarding the treatment of prisoners in the camps, they were put up on charges by the SS.

The criminal charges by the SS against SS members make no sense if the SS were officially mandated by the SS to exterminate their prisoners by the masses anyways.
Last Edit: 28 Jul 2019 20:05 by annabelle.
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The Holocaust 28 Jul 2019 20:24 #3443

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As Frothy said - it has all been said here before - more or less. No one side has convinced the other. We could do a round 2 and just go over the same ground again as an exercise in nostalgia.


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The Holocaust 28 Jul 2019 22:38 #3444

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Well I for one am sick of hearing about 'the holocaust' here in the real world. It's been over seventy years since WW2 ended yet Jews act like it all happened only yesterday. I am sick of the national CBC radio programming forever interviewing Jews and 'holocaust' victims/descendents while they go on again and again about how horrible it all was, the gassings, the ovens, the six million dead (always six million even now).

Over and over and over....

You would not think anyone else actually died in WW2, that there were no others....just the Jews, the Jews, the Jews, the Jews, the Jews and the 'concentration camps'.

I am sick of having Jew owned/run media. Living in a Jew world. It's what brought on what happened in Germany in the first place.
Last Edit: 28 Jul 2019 22:45 by annabelle.
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The Holocaust 28 Jul 2019 23:06 #3445

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well it's clear you are anti semitic LOL


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The Holocaust 29 Jul 2019 08:25 #3446

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Gloria wrote:
while it is true that there were no greater evils that Lenin and Stalin who killed about 40 Million of their population including the Romanovs

it is also true that the Alllies had knowing about the Nazi Concentration Camps before liberation :)

Definately.

Matter of fact, the Red Cross had full access to the camps and they never mentioned anything about killings going on.
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The Holocaust 29 Jul 2019 08:32 #3447

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annabelle wrote:
Well I for one am sick of hearing about 'the holocaust' here in the real world. It's been over seventy years since WW2 ended yet Jews act like it all happened only yesterday. I am sick of the national CBC radio programming forever interviewing Jews and 'holocaust' victims/descendents while they go on again and again about how horrible it all was, the gassings, the ovens, the six million dead (always six million even now).

Over and over and over....

You would not think anyone else actually died in WW2, that there were no others....just the Jews, the Jews, the Jews, the Jews, the Jews and the 'concentration camps'.

I am sick of having Jew owned/run media. Living in a Jew world. It's what brought on what happened in Germany in the first place.



:D
Last Edit: 29 Jul 2019 08:33 by Flare.
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The Holocaust 29 Jul 2019 09:47 #3448

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Lady does the math on how many jews can be processed with the 52 crematoria ovens as Auschwitz.

(I suggest Frothy takes a look at this short video)


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The Holocaust 29 Jul 2019 12:12 #3449

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I suggest that Flare starts thinking for himself and stops being so gullible.

The woman says that putting seven corpses in an oven at a time would be 84 corpses in 24 hours per oven because each corpse takes 2 hrs to cremate.

84 x 52 = 4368 corpses cremated each day
4368 x 365 (days per years) = 1,594,820 per year.

Now according to the chief engineer Kurt Prüfer the ovens were only working at 73 percent of their advertised assumed capacity prior to installation, so we need to deduct 27 percent from the overall cremation capacity rate.

1,594,820 - 27 percent = 1,163,853.6 in one year.

So excluding the open air burning pits,, over only a two year period the total would be 2,327,707.2 cremations. :thumbup:
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Last Edit: 29 Jul 2019 12:25 by Frothy.
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The Holocaust 29 Jul 2019 12:37 #3450

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And by the way the lady isn't even quoting the United States Holocaust Memorial Museum statement correctly, what it really states is
During the deportation of Hungarian Jews in the spring of 1944, Auschwitz-Birkenau reached peak killing capacity: the SS gassed as many as 6,000 Jews each day.
encyclopedia.ushmm.org/content/en/article/killing-centers-in-depth

Anyway, Flare states that Zyklon-B (Hydrogen cyanide) won't kill humans :iitm: there's no point continuing any sensible debate with him under that circumstance.

According to the witness statements there were four bodies cremated at a time, adults and children, and a combination of emaciated
starved bodies and a fresh deportee usually a woman to add extra fat to the burning procedure.

I'll do a calculation on that basis of 4 bodies per oven over a 22 hr period with a 3 hr burning period, and I'll just use 50 ovens assuming that 2 were always not in use.
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Last Edit: 29 Jul 2019 14:13 by Frothy.
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The Holocaust 29 Jul 2019 13:16 #3451

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Photos of ovens in Auschwitz




2005 photo of an oven in the main Auschwitz camp


photo of the rear of an Auschwitz oven and where the ashes were removed


photo shows that the ovens were very close to an interior door into the Auschwitz 'gas chamber'


photo of a trolley car used to put bodies into an oven in Auschwitz main camp

There is no way that multiple amounts of bodies at a time could fit inside those Auschwitz ovens. As quoted below, I could see two at most.

quote:

Wikipedia says the following about the cremation process at Majdanek (but implies that this is the same for the furnaces at Birkenau );-

“The Holocaust furnaces were supplied by a number of manufacturers, with the best known and most common being Topf and Sons as well as Kori Company of Berlin, whose ovens were elongated to accommodate two bodies, slid inside from the back side. The ashes were taken out from the front side. The furnaces were also unique, in that they were of a “stand alone” type.

Meaning that there was no visible duct work for the exhaust gases. These furnaces, based around a design commonly used for hospital incinerators, instead vented the gasses down through a series of ducts embedded in the floor, with the help of a draft fan located at the far end of the structure. Once outside, the gasses then rose through a free standing chimney, most notable for the fact that it was not directly attached to the structure of the building itself, nor had a visible duct leading into it.”

The “Jewish Virtual Library” say this;-

“It had two ovens which were brought to Majdanek from the Sachsenhausen camp in Germany. The new crematorium was outfitted with five Kori ovens which were fueled with coke. When you first walk into the crematorium, you see the row of five ovens. They are placed so close to the entrance door that you realize that there would not have been enough room for workers to slide the bodies inside.

Then you walk around to the other side and see that the bodies were put into the ovens from the back side and the ashes taken out on the front side, close to the entrance door. You can look all the way through the ovens and see that the interior of each oven is long enough to accommodate two bodies.”

So they both seem to be suggesting that two bodies weren’t piled on top of each other in the furnace retorts, but were stretched out lengthwise next to each other.

This is news to me, because I’ve never heard of this arrangement before. But one has to ask if the furnace could actually work efficiently, because you are doubling the size of the retort, and would probably need twice the amount of heat to be generated and distributed around the chamber.

Wikipedia even claims the furnaces were based upon a design used for hospital incinerators. But is this correct? or are they just hoping that a little bit of technical jargon might satisfy their readers.

And it is a strange arrangement for an alleged production line of body disposal in an extermination program, for the heavy bodies to be lugged around to the rear of the facility, while the light-weight ashes are retrieved from the front !

But one has to admire Wikipedia’s coyness in describing the “free standing chimney” without any connection to the cremation facility. It says that there is no “visible duct leading duct into it”. Quite – it was an invisible duct – a magical, mysterious one that was only known to the sondercommandos.

furtherglory.wordpress.com/2016/08/26/were-the-holocaust-ovens-too-small-to-have-been-used-to-kill-6-million-jews/

“most of the memoirs and reports of Holocaust survivors are full of preposterous verbosity, graphomanic exaggeration, dramatic effects, overestimated self-inflation, dilettante philosophizing, would-be lyricism, unchecked rumors, bias, partisan attacks…”
–Samuel Gringauz, “Jewish Social Studies” (New York), January 1950,
Last Edit: 29 Jul 2019 13:28 by annabelle.
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The Holocaust 29 Jul 2019 13:20 #3452

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4 corpses= one emaciated, one fresh deportee with some body fat, and two children.

4 corpses cremated every 3 hours = 24 corpses in 22 hrs (two hrs down time)

24 corpses x 50 ovens (assuming 2 ovens are always under repair and out of action) = 1,200 corpses per day.


912 days in 2.5 years, estimated overall cremation time period (excluding the earlier use of crem 1 and open air burning pits)

1.200 x 912 = 1, 094,400 so we're near the figure of the new plaque.
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Last Edit: 29 Jul 2019 14:09 by Frothy.
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The Holocaust 29 Jul 2019 13:34 #3453

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Seems like enough room for another adult and two children.
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Last Edit: 29 Jul 2019 13:51 by Frothy.
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The Holocaust 29 Jul 2019 13:45 #3454

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Modern Day Cremation Process Explained - May 2018

quote:

When a body is ready to be cremated, it is removed from cold storage and placed on a retractable table that looks like a gurney, then wheeled over to one of the machines.

While the door can open about 30 to 35 inches wide, most operators open it only a foot or so, enough to accommodate the width of the body. Any more than that will let out too much heat, exposing the operator and the room to fiery temperatures. The body slides in, pushed with a tool or by hand. There are rollers on the gurney and sometimes on the floor of the cremation unit so the casket can slide with ease.

A cremation unit has two chambers: the primary chamber, where the body goes, and the secondary or “after” chamber, where the gases generated are burned off.

The primary chamber has brick-lined walls, and a floor and roof made of high heat refractory concrete. A burner descends from the roof and heats the chamber to about 1,200 degrees Fahrenheit, enough to break down a body into gas and bone fragments.

The resulting gases and particulates travel into the after-chamber, a 30-foot maze designed to retain the gases for about two seconds. The after-chamber subjects the gases to a temperature of 1,700 degrees F to make sure the particles and odor are negligible before everything goes up the stack and out into the atmosphere. Gamage says you can think of the secondary chamber like the catalytic converter on an old car, which neutralizes the emissions of the exhaust system.

“Any solid will turn to gas if heated to the right point. That’s essentially what happens to the body, when the tissue is heated to the point where it’s combustible and turns to gas,” Gamage says. “But just like in any combustion device, whether it’s a car or a backyard grill, when you burn something, there’s going to be emissions generated. The key is to design equipment that consumes most of the emissions so that they fall within the state environmental regulations.”

Problems arise when gases build up in the secondary chamber and begin to overflow. That can happen if the machine isn’t designed properly or if the operator overloads the primary chamber, which can happen for surprising reasons. For example, putting an obese person in the unit at the wrong time of day.

As macabre as it may sound, weight is something crematorium operators must worry about.

The machine doesn’t know the difference between a person who weighs 150 pounds and a person who weighs 400. It just does its job. The cremator’s rule of thumb is that 100 pounds of human fat is the equivalent of 17 gallons of kerosene.

If you have a body that weighs 400 pounds, at least 200 of it will be fat that will burn rapidly. If you put that person into a very hot machine, as the cremation unit tends to be at the end of the day when it’s been running for hours, the chamber may emit smoke and odor out of the stack.

“It’s just too much gas for the machine to handle,” Gamage says. “Most experienced operators will do those larger cases as the first cremation of the day, when the machine is colder.”

Inside the Rosehill crematorium, I’m staring at a computer monitor that reduces this ritual into raw data. The body inside is a male, it’s the second case of the day, it’s in a cardboard container weighing 201 to 350 lbs, and it has already been there for an hour and 20 minutes. A diagram on the screen shows the machine’s various chambers.

Three little blue flames are illuminated under one of the chambers, indicating that “hearth air” is now being blown in to the chamber to help cool it down. It’s currently between 910 and 1150 degrees inside, but moments earlier, the temperature had been 1600 to 1800 degrees.

Altogether, it takes about an hour and a half to cremate a body, though that varies depending on the person’s weight and the type of casket they’re in. The time-consuming nature limits the number of bodies each can cremate. During my visit, all five of Rosehill’s machines were in various states of operation just to keep up with demand. Each needs to get five bodies done in eight hours. Rosehill’s cremation units run six days a week, standing idle only on Sundays.

“For religious reasons?” I ask Koslovski.

“No,” he says. “we just need a day off.”

www.popularmechanics.com/science/health/a18923323/cremation/

That is the exacting process for a modern day crematorium.
Last Edit: 29 Jul 2019 13:52 by annabelle.
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The Holocaust 29 Jul 2019 13:54 #3455

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Annabelle wrote:
The cremator’s rule of thumb is that 100 pounds of human fat is the equivalent of 17 gallons of kerosene.
It just goes to show why they included a fresh deportee with the four corpses, it added a fuel source as noted above, it's a point that i've made here many times.
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Last Edit: 29 Jul 2019 14:07 by Frothy.
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The Holocaust 29 Jul 2019 14:34 #3456

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If there is one thing we can all agree upon, it is that the Nazis were highly organized and honored the German history of engineering.


Knowing that, and imagining that Holocaust Story, means they must have organized the "biggest genocide of his-story" also in the same way.

Yet, why would they gas 1000s of people with having so poor cremation facilities where just 1, maximum 2 bodies fit in.

That means with every gassing and limited cremation the dead bodies were piling up, which is very dangerous for the health especially of the valuable SS personnel.

Then we have all the different methods states to have been used, up to never developed "electrical floors".

The Story doesn't make a lick of sense.
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The Holocaust 29 Jul 2019 17:56 #3457

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Holocaust-denier historian David Irving was jailed a while back, I just sent the e-mail below to his website and will post his reply if I get one-

Hi, if the Holocaust never happened, why was Mr. Irving jailed for saying so?
Didn't he have any solid irrefutable PROOF that it never happened, to prove his case?
Mick in Plymouth


Guardian Weekly news item-
Holocaust denier jailed.
David Irving, the discredited British historian and Nazi apologist, was this week starting a three-year prison sentence in Vienna for denying the Holocaust and the gas chambers of Auschwitz.
www.theguardian.com/guardianweekly/story/0,,1715580,00.html

Irving's website-
fpp.co.uk/
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The Holocaust 29 Jul 2019 18:05 #3458

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you might consider that the burden of proof lies with those who claim it did happen.


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The Holocaust 29 Jul 2019 18:12 #3459

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Voltaire wrote:
you might consider that the burden of proof lies with those who claim it did happen.

And to also consider what their MOTIVES were for claiming the holocaust happened?
What did they stand to gain?
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The Holocaust 29 Jul 2019 18:36 #3460

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That is a kind of deflection. If it happened they need to provide evidence. Period. What they stand to gain is secondary.


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