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TOPIC: Calculate the distance to the Sun (where is the Sun?)

Calculate the distance to the Sun (where is the Sun?) 13 May 2016 11:55 #1

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Calculate the distance to the Sun (where is the Sun?)






Video description:

An short in-depth investigation and experimental method into calculating the distance to the Sun with as few assumptions as possible. The scientific method for calculating the distance to the Sun is described in detail in the video.

Basically June 21st the Summer Solstice is taken as a reference and trigonometry is attempted in order to triangulate the position and distance of the Sun from the Earth.

Unfortunately I failed to triangulate the Sun on this day, conclusively and the reasons will become obvious while watching the video.
The video raises some significant questions regarding the accuracy of our elevations angles, distances to the known celestial bodies, the curvature of light and even the shape of our Earth and even the whole Universe.

Everything we know could be at stake and the conclusions that were reached in this video can be confirmed just by verifying a number of elevation angles!

This is EASY! Go forth and verify!
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"The truth must be repeated over and over again,
because error is repeatedly preached among us, not
only by individuals, but by the masses. In periodicals
and cyclopaedias, in schools and universities; every-
where, in fact, error prevails, and is quite easy in the
feeling that it has a decided majority on its side."

~ J. W. v. Goethe

Johannes Lang "The Hollow World Theory" Blog
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Calculate the distance to the Sun (where is the Sun?) 13 May 2016 21:57 #2

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The calculations are well done and it indeed raises questions that can only be answered by real experiments, not taking the data of PSA and NOAA for granted.

The jump to conclusions is of course not well done, as this guy excludes all other problems with a "concave Earth model", such as:
- the size of the Sun and the Moon are equal at any moment X from place A and B on Earth. If the Sun and Moon would be small and close by, that is impossible
- in a concave Earth "model" we would have a 360 degree view of the Moon, being able to see her back side from one end while the observer from the other end sees her front. Clearly that is not the case; we always observe the same side of the Moon, explained in convex heliocentric model due to tidal locking of the Moon, some wobbles causing to see more than 50% of her surface
- the concave Earth "model" doesn't explain how it can be night on 1 hemisphere while it is day on the other, same problem in Flat Earth
- seismic waves would not be able to travel through the Earth and show the same pattern; that is only possible on a convex Earth
- no explanation for parallax; showing many stars are far away, some are "close by" (e.g. Barnard's Star) and shift over the years
- no explanation for supernovas
- no explanation for the mechanism; how do all the other planets revolve around the Sun in concave Earth?
- no explanation for origin of planets, moons and stars
- plate tectonics doesn't work on a concave shape, causing great stress problems we don't observe in reality

You cannot just take a simple and -nicely illustrated- example that raises questions about the Sun and expecially the way light travels, then put your fingers in your ears to all other complexities and just propose a model that demonstrably fails at the simplest observations.

Well, you can, but its foolish.
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Calculate the distance to the Sun (where is the Sun?) 28 May 2016 21:21 #3

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This brilliant Greek researcher does not postulate that the earth is concave,
as you would know if you had watched the video, but on the contrary, he
is doing free mathematical research with one aim only, to find out where the
sun really is.


So your comment is unsurprisingly "bang out of order"
but here you go, he found out that something is not quite right and thus did not stop his research.


You may want to watch his consequent video or at least read the video description:





Video description:

My original video published on September 24 2015 is online but is blocked in the US due to the Beatles soundtrack. I am reuploading it today with new soundtrack.

I hope this will help some spherists to reproduce the calculations.

This is a follow up to video https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9puRZH0i6Sc titled 'Calculate the distance to the Sun (where is the Sun?) '.
I have a serious problem...I cannot find the sun!
I tried and tried ...and then, I tried again...
I still cannot triangulate the position of the sun, from the earth!
What are we to make of this? I do not know...
What I do know for sure...is that there is only ONE SUN and that it has only ONE POSITION in the sky.
So, WHERE IS THE SUN?

Just in case these angles are ever changed in the future by their respective sources, here is proof that they are valid today 23 September 2015.

1. NOAA Solar Position Calculator
www.esrl.noaa.gov/gmd/grad/solcalc/azel.html
2. NOAA Solar Calculator
www.esrl.noaa.gov/gmd/grad/solcalc/
3. pveducation.org - Sun's Position to High Accuracy
www.pveducation.org/pvcdrom/properties-of-sunlight/sun-position-high-accuracy

This is called 'a CONUNDRUM'..www.google.com/search?q=CONUNDRAM&ie=utf-8&oe=utf-8&pageId=104054767330930134612#q=CONUNDRUM. It is either that our official organisations (NOAA NASA etc) are WRONG and are making HUGE mistakes in their calculators,
OR
our official organisations are RIGHT and our Earth is NOT SPHERICAL and the sun is NOT where they say it is!
LOL What a CONUNDRUM huh!


:chuckle:
"The truth must be repeated over and over again,
because error is repeatedly preached among us, not
only by individuals, but by the masses. In periodicals
and cyclopaedias, in schools and universities; every-
where, in fact, error prevails, and is quite easy in the
feeling that it has a decided majority on its side."

~ J. W. v. Goethe

Johannes Lang "The Hollow World Theory" Blog
My Zone by PFIZIPFEI
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Calculate the distance to the Sun (where is the Sun?) 29 May 2016 16:42 #4

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Hi all,
One of your board members alerted me to this discussion and asked me to chime in.
I am the author of the video in question at the top of this thread and I am happy to see people taking an interest as I am not promoting any of my videos anywhere. I made them out of frustration one day back in september 2015 because I was fed up with all the FET promotion. As a science graduate and educated/indoctrinated on the Heliocentric model all my life, I just wanted a simple way of proving the HC model correct. So I sat down and did this simple test on a piece of paper. The results obviously blew me away! and my conclusions were NOT that FET or Concave were instead correct... No! My conclusions are actually below my elevation angles verification video!
" It is either that our official organisations (NOAA NASA etc) are WRONG and are making HUGE mistakes in their calculators,
OR
our official organisations are RIGHT and our Earth is NOT SPHERICAL and the sun is NOT where they say it is! "

This is the only conclusion you can derive.

If we could organize some people from all over the world to take ACTUAL ACCURATE measurements on the equinoxes or the solstices, we could verify where the sun actually is and how far away it actually is.
My video should be taken as a nudge for further investigation. It is the beginning and not an end. Physical research is needed.
One thing is for sure... we have no idea what is going on! DO you think I have an answer? My answer is 'We are in the dark' and our government agencies seems to like it that way!

I made a couple of other videos which you may find interesting after this, reason being the ancient Greek assumptions based on VISUAL observations. Again, these are based on the assumption that light is straight as an arrow and therefore the image you see in your eyes is straight in front of you. What on Earth gave us that impression?

Thanks for being inquisitive. Keep pushing the envelope. Do not take everything for granted.
Aim for absolute proof with physical repeatable experimental evidence.

Check out: The Truth of Light Exposed
and The Global Deception
because they are all related.

Sincerely
Conandrum
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Calculate the distance to the Sun (where is the Sun?) 29 May 2016 16:54 #5

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Oh and by the way the video posted by Ragnarok is very very inaccurate as accurate calculations cannot be made since geometry will not work unless on a plane. The calculation in that video have no common plane now, do they? )))
Forget about it!




Annotation:
The video you are referring to was mainstream and thus off-topic
therefore it was moved to truth-zone.net/forum/pfizipfei-forum-general-discussion/67226-excerpt-of-calculate-the-distance-to-the-sun-where-is-the-sun.html
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Last Edit: 29 May 2016 21:58 by PFIZIPFEI.
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Calculate the distance to the Sun (where is the Sun?) 29 May 2016 17:10 #6

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Hi Conandrum

Welcome on Truth Zone!

It's an honour to have the author of those brilliant scientific videos here,
so that members who are seriously interested can ask valid questions.

PFIZIPFEI

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"The truth must be repeated over and over again,
because error is repeatedly preached among us, not
only by individuals, but by the masses. In periodicals
and cyclopaedias, in schools and universities; every-
where, in fact, error prevails, and is quite easy in the
feeling that it has a decided majority on its side."

~ J. W. v. Goethe

Johannes Lang "The Hollow World Theory" Blog
My Zone by PFIZIPFEI
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Calculate the distance to the Sun (where is the Sun?) 29 May 2016 17:17 #7

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Conandrum, welcome to TZ.
ly is.
My video should be taken as a nudge for further investigation. It is the beginning and not an end. Physical research is needed.
One thing is for sure... we have no idea what is going on! DO you think I have an answer? My answer is 'We are in the dark' and our government agencies seems to like it that way!

I want to believe you but it was your set-up and choice of premise that do not coincide with this theoretically right stance.

Your premise is an obviously flawed idea ("model" is far too generous a name): the concave Earth.

Your observations were right but rely on internet data. It's the real angular experiments that should bring clues. NOAA and the other site may well be wrong, after all they are "authorities".

You destroyed your own good first half by coming with the bullshit concave idea in the second half. Pity, really.
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Calculate the distance to the Sun (where is the Sun?) 29 May 2016 21:00 #8

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I seriously doubt that any of the commentators watched the videos.

The posts by the usual suspects expose their ignorance of the contents and their fear
to learn something which they are unable to process, let alone refute, intellectually, but
most of all ideologically.

Gaia is the new rodin?

Backed by the dif pit crew ...

I do understand if no decent man who did his own research and worked on it in such a most decent
scientific way, like Conandrum, is inclined to stay here for more than one or two comments ...



As some of you may have noticed I changed my mind
about having this thread outside of my sub-forum, for
the trolling by the usual suspects unsurprisingly started
to make constructive, civilised, serious conversation on
this subject already almost impossible.
The excerpted, moved posts can be found there: CLICK
PFIZIPFEI
"The truth must be repeated over and over again,
because error is repeatedly preached among us, not
only by individuals, but by the masses. In periodicals
and cyclopaedias, in schools and universities; every-
where, in fact, error prevails, and is quite easy in the
feeling that it has a decided majority on its side."

~ J. W. v. Goethe

Johannes Lang "The Hollow World Theory" Blog
My Zone by PFIZIPFEI
Last Edit: 29 May 2016 22:45 by PFIZIPFEI.
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Calculate the distance to the Sun (where is the Sun?) 30 May 2016 00:45 #9

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I watched the whole video.

The first part is strong and decent; showing a major problem in well-constructed figures.

It is the second part that is not:
- concluding that Heliocentric Earth (HE) is "wrong" just on this problem is far too little ground
- presenting Flat Earth (FE), which is a deliberate disinfo strategy by NASA and related crooks and concluding that idea is wrong is ok
- but then jumping to the obvious premise conandrum had before the video; Concave Earth therefore must be right is not an open minded fair scientific analysis. There are numerous problems with CE (many shared with FE, such as the apparent sizes of Moon and Sun, the origins of celestial bodies, inconsistency in the "model" and things like seismic wave propagation and plate tectonics that rely on a convex Earth) and without addressing any of those, conandrum shouldn't have jumped to conclusions, less if he says "it's just the beginning"

With you I hope he stays around and contributes in analysing this problem further as it is an obvious flaw that cannot be disregarded without properly understanding.

I am not "the new" anyone. I am unique, my texts should show that enough. And especially interested in these topics; Earth sciences are wildly interesting.
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"The silence of conspiracy. Slaughtered on the altar of apathy." - Lords of the New Church (1982)
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Calculate the distance to the Sun (where is the Sun?) 04 Jun 2016 01:53 #10

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Hi Gaia,

Please do not misunderstand my video and my conclusion.
To see my conclusion you can forward my video to 11:00m or click the link below to take you directly to my conclusion.

My conclusion concludes at 11:45!
After that what you find is an appendix and my further thoughts on what my own opinion about what might be the reason that is causing these strange angles, IF they are correct!
I start by saying "I also have a theory! maybe the flat earth model can explain some things?"... maybe the concave model? because surely I have exhausted my options to explain these values using the heliocentric model... haven't I?
In case you think I have not exhausted my options on the Heliocentric model, in order to explain these values from 2, mind you, official sources, at 11:39 I make a public request to anyone who knows why we cannot triangulate the sun with official government elevation angles and STRAIGHT LIGHT!!!! Do you know why?
If you do not, then my conclusion still applies -
1. Rubbish elevation angles from our OVER-SUBSIDIZED by trillions of dollars official bodies or
2. Light is not straight!

What else can I say? If you do not like my appendix and my little discussion on the various models then you can disregard it.
Even so, a major reason why I included the concave model was due to the ABSOLUTELY WEIRD GLITCH I found at 45 degrees!!!
In my mind this is not an accident or coincidence. There is a reason why it exists.
It is either a glitch in the mathematical formulas used to churn out SYNTHETIC elevation angles or it is an IMPORTANT SIDE-EFFECT of the way light travels to the observer from the source.
I thought it was important to note that the glitch could be explained by a concave earth model. However I did not want to leave the flat earth model out on purpose and I therefore included a very small section showing its huge shortcomings.
After all, it was because of the FET disinformation videos out there that I felt compelled to sit down one day back in September 2015 and put pen to paper. That was the day that I discovered that I could not triangulate the Sun.
It may seem trivial to you watching my video on YT from the comfort of your sofa, but believe me when I tell you that on that evening and after many calculations and drawings, my jaw was ON THE FLOOR!
This is not a trivial matter. In my mind this is HUGE.
If they are so inaccurate, then why are we paying them so many billions each year? Why don't we have absolutely impeccable and accurate elevation angle data? On the other hand, if the data is accurate, then you can be assured that the Sun is NOT where you think it is - and if the Sun is not there, then where is it? How far away is it? Are we in a HC system or not?
Of course one can just change the channel and roll over.
What I do not want from people is a shooting of the messenger... I have only reported the absolute naked truth.
What you do with it is your business. Go forth and investigate further is my message.

Thanks for listening and check out my other videos I posted above which I arrived at based on this first experience.
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Calculate the distance to the Sun (where is the Sun?) 04 Jun 2016 02:14 #11

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Your work is excellent, conandrum, I have said that all the time. But I would stick to your phrase; "It is the start to investigate further". Your calculations, presented well, are certainly the basis for thought and critical review of the current model.

But stay at that. Going into FE is a diversion, as you admit yourself and thus the debunking of it to then skip over to CE (concave Earth) has no value.

The second part where you propose CE as "right" because of 1 45 degrees "glitch" is not serious scientific investigation and imho spoils your great work in the first part.

Without addressing ALLLL the problems that CE has in explaining daily observations, it is far too early to jump to the idea/"conclusion" that CE must be right, or "addresses the problem with the 45 degrees, so I am happy enough".

What about all the points I've listed here and in other topics about CE? What about all the other clues for HE?

It may be light does not travel in straight lines [in space!], which would also tumble an enormous amount of research.
It may be the values given by NOAA and the other site are incorrect.
It may be the Earth is lit by a Sun that is farther away and bigger or closer by and smaller.
It may be a combination of all those points.

If your purpose of your video is to show there are agencies fooling us, then I'd say cut off the last part and take it to some willing, uncompromised astronomers.

If your purpose is to push CE, or at least suggest that that "model" (it's not, as nobody has ever predicted a solar or lunar eclipse with it) has value, then you won't be taken seriously by any astronomer or natural scientist in general. Which makes your first part the victim of the vicious "guilty by association" tactics that are all around us.

You see my point with it?
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Calculate the distance to the Sun (where is the Sun?) 06 Jun 2016 02:56 #12

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Yes I see your point.
However I have no taboos unlike others around me.
In all my years in the education I was taught that people in the past believed that the Earth was flat, but never was I taught that there was also a third version called Concave Earth.
It may be that you were born with all three options clearly laid out in your brain from birth, but I was not.
So in my mind, it is imperative in my video to make it abundantly clear that a third option exists which may explain the glitch at 45 degrees and that model is the concave. I bet that most people will die without ever hearing of this option - many of them astronomers!
I am not in the business of withholding information!
Also I am not in any danger of being ridiculed I assure you, because I am not pushing the CEM as the truth but as an option that may require further investigation, simply because the HEM does NOT explain the angles and because FET does not explain the angles!!! So what is left? CEM whether we like it or not! It only follows from the logical conclusions.
Regarding all the issues you specify with any alternative model, I agree with you that I have nothing to offer you and I do not plan on affering any solutions to these problems. Let me remind you that the HEM was not built in a day! It took centuries for the model to evolve and sand down all the rough edges. So I do not expect CEM to be taken seriously any day now. Only when scientists are forced into this mode of thinking will your issues be solved IN YOUR MINDS! I say "in your minds" because there may be people out there already who have all these issues solved already and you just do not know it or you just don't want to believe that they do because they are not authorized and corroborated by mainstream science. I am sure if you search for answers to your CEM issues you will find much that may satisfy you or not but be careful not to ridicule yourself to yourself if you find satisfactory answers! )))
Anyway, I am not the person to do this job for you. I just brought something to your attention - AS IS! It will never be changed and I do not give my permission to anybody to cut my video up into pieces. If you want to show this video in its entirety or host it anywhere that is OK as long as you provide a link to the channel so that people may be able to find any updates in the future. That's all.
AS IS means no guarantees - what you see is what you get.
As I said it is the beginning....
My recommendation to all of you is to put your minds together and find a way to TEST the data in the video on a solstice or a equinox globally!!
This will put things in perspective and we can move to the next level, with REAL DATA, which is WHERE IS THE SUN!
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Calculate the distance to the Sun (where is the Sun?) 06 Jun 2016 05:24 #13

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Thanks conandrum, you're right about the "mentioning a 3rd model idea, that maybe people haven't heard about".

I just heard about it right before registering here. You know Wild Heretic? That guy has a whole blog where he treats the details of CE quite in full, though it's still incomplete and not satisfying in answers.

There is a solstice coming up in 2 weeks and we could make it into a TZ effort.

Instead of measuring angles (which requires technology none of us have), we can do it easier; check the time of sunset. Anyone living in Tromso would have a problem and waits all day, but it would be a double test; check if the data those websites report is correct and gather data to put in your nice software.

Because then we have data indicating at which time on Earth the angle is not 45, 38 or 66, but 0.... with that dataset it should be possible to do something...?
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Calculate the distance to the Sun (where is the Sun?) 13 Jun 2016 02:52 #14

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I do not think we can do something with the time of sunset. At sunset the atmospheric refraction is the highest so we have the highest error. We need angles and we need them from specific places on the earth. they have to be on the ecliptic plane. I find it amazing that with so much money and technology NOBODY on this planet has done this already! It would be the first thing I would do to verify mankind's theories.
Furthermore, sunset in most cities is blocked by the elevation of the land, so it is inaccurate unless you are doing it over the sea. right?
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Calculate the distance to the Sun (where is the Sun?) 13 Jun 2016 03:20 #15

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Maybe people have done it already, but we dont know about it. :hahano:

And over oceans makes the most sense to eliminate elevation differences across the board.
I remember the good old days, when 90+ year olds in nursing homes lived forever. Darn this pesky virus.

1365 = 1

1.1365 = 1,283,305,580,313,352
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Calculate the distance to the Sun (where is the Sun?) 13 Jun 2016 03:23 #16

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ragnarok wrote:
Conundrum, can you explain where the creator of this website is going wrong?

www.khanacademy.org/partner-content/nasa/measuringuniverse


If you want to know where someone might be going wrong, check his assumptions.
Assumptions made in a model or theory should be mentioned at the beginning of a thesis.
Heliocentric, geocentric, and flat models/theories make a first assumption in that they BELIEVE (religious belief) that light travels through the vastness of space in absolutely straight lines. This is an Assumption and has never been verified.
HC model makes a second assumption, that our solar system including the earth revolve around the sun.
From these 2 starting points, all mathematics that follow are very correct. It is just the foundation that is not cast in stone!

To be perfectly honest, if I had not sat down last September to make my own calculations with elevation angles to the sun for June 21st solstice and if I had not found any inconsistencies and if I had been able to at least triangulate the sun to a very rough approximation, then I would NEVER have doubted the Heliocentric model.
Since I was not able to do that with verifiable official government institution data that is their job to provide the public with reliable information, then my doubts are justified.
Don't you think?
Are we supposed to all have a herd mentality? Is everyone that does not say "Bbbbb..eeeeeeeee" a NWO agent? Is the herd always supposed to bring the roaming sheep back inline with the status quo? Or are we supposed to be pioneers, researchers and bring back to the herd every little shred of evidence to the contrary of the 'truth' we are being fed if it is an honest and Real Truth? Have I given you lies? Haven't I given you every opportunity to VERIFY the data presented?
I hope you all understand the concepts of 'Plato's cave' and 'herd mentality'.
PS. Just because I have doubts does not mean that I have DIS-PROVEN the HC model. It only means that I am not satisfied with it anymore. Until I can triangulate the sun with REAL elevation angles taken on a solstice or equinox from the ecliptic plane, I do not think I will ever be convinced. And when this happens I will tell you how far away the sun really is and whether I am back on board with the HC model or not. )))
Last Edit: 13 Jun 2016 09:08 by PFIZIPFEI.
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Calculate the distance to the Sun (where is the Sun?) 13 Jun 2016 07:23 #17

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If someone had already thought of it or done it, we would have come across this by now.
I am simply astounded! Goes to show how superficially we just accept everything served to us in our plate.
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Calculate the distance to the Sun (where is the Sun?) 13 Jun 2016 14:45 #18

  • ragnarok
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If you think there is something wrong with the measurements based on your analysis of figures given by the establishment, you need to make your presentation more layman-friendly than it is if you want more people asking the same questions.
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Calculate the distance to the Sun (where is the Sun?) 13 Jun 2016 17:02 #19

  • conandrum
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Maybe you are right my friend.
I may have another go at it, making a much simpler version, or maybe I need to make a webpage going over it with more simplified graphics.
Thanks for suggesting it.
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Calculate the distance to the Sun (where is the Sun?) 04 Jul 2016 20:20 #20

  • PFIZIPFEI
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I look very much forward to your new video
and to more of your most interesting insights.



.
"The truth must be repeated over and over again,
because error is repeatedly preached among us, not
only by individuals, but by the masses. In periodicals
and cyclopaedias, in schools and universities; every-
where, in fact, error prevails, and is quite easy in the
feeling that it has a decided majority on its side."

~ J. W. v. Goethe

Johannes Lang "The Hollow World Theory" Blog
My Zone by PFIZIPFEI
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