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TOPIC: The Speed of Light is Not Constant.

The Speed of Light is Not Constant. 01 Mar 2015 11:26 #1

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Far from me it is to join in with the Einstein bashing round here but there appears to be something wrong with the speed of light and other scientific constants.

It's all pretty much touched upon in this, banned TED presentation from Rupert Sheldrake



Any information would be appreciated, no Archons or Reptoids though please.
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The Speed of Light is Not Constant. 01 Mar 2015 20:09 #2

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Einstein's theory of special relativity sets of the speed of light, 186,000 miles per second (300 million meters per second). But some scientists are exploring the possibility that this cosmic speed limit changes.

The speed of light is constant, or so textbooks say. But some scientists are exploring the possibility that this cosmic speed limit changes, a consequence of the nature of the vacuum of space.

The definition of the speed of light has some broader implications for fields such as cosmology and astronomy, which assume a stable velocity for light over time. For instance, the speed of light comes up when measuring the fine structure constant (alpha), which defines the strength of the electromagnetic force. And a varying light speed would change the strengths of molecular bonds and the density of nuclear matter itself.

A non-constant speed of light could mean that estimates of the size of the universe might be off. (Unfortunately, it won't necessarily mean we can travel faster than light, because the effects of physics theories such as relativity are a consequence of light's velocity). [10 Implications of Faster-Than-Light Travel]

Two papers, published in the European Physics Journal D in March, attempt to derive the speed of light from the quantum properties of space itself. Both propose somewhat different mechanisms, but the idea is that the speed of light might change as one alters assumptions about how elementary particles interact with radiation. Both treat space as something that isn't empty, but a great big soup of virtual particles that wink in and out of existence in tiny fractions of a second.

Cosmic vacuum and light speed

The first, by lead author Marcel Urban of the Université du Paris-Sud, looks at the cosmic vacuum, which is often assumed to be empty space. The laws of quantum physics, which govern subatomic particles and all things very small, say that the vacuum of space is actually full of fundamental particles like quarks, called "virtual" particles. These matter particles, which are always paired up with their appropriate antiparticle counterpart, pop into existence and almost immediately collide. When matter and antimatter particles touch, they annihilate each other.

Photons of light, as they fly through space, are captured and re-emitted by these virtual particles. Urban and his colleagues propose that the energies of these particles — specifically the amount of charge they carry — affect the speed of light. Since the amount of energy a particle will have at the time a photon hits it will be essentially random, the effect on how fast photons move should vary too.

As such, the amount of time the light takes to cross a given distance should vary as the square root of that distance, though the effect would be very tiny — on the order of 0.05 femtoseconds for every square meter of vacuum. A femtosecond is a millionth of a billionth of a second. (The speed of light has been measured over the last century to high precision, on the order of parts per billion, so it is pretty clear that the effect has to be small.)

To find this tiny fluctuation, the researchers say, one could measure how light disperses at long distances. Some astronomical phenomena, such as gamma-ray bursts, produce pulses of radiation from far enough away that the fluctuations could be detected. The authors also propose using lasers bounced between mirrors placed about 100 yards apart, with a light beam bouncing between them multiple times, to seek those small changes.





Particle species and light speed

The second paper proposes a different mechanism but comes to the same conclusion that light speed changes. In that case, Gerd Leuchs and Luis Sánchez-Soto, from the Max Planck Institute for the Physics of Light in Erlangen, Germany, say that the number of species of elementary particle that exist in the universe may be what makes the speed of light what it is.

Leuchs and Sanchez-Soto say that there should be, by their calculations, on the order of 100 "species" of particle that have charges. The current law governing particle physics, the Standard Model, identifies nine: the electron, muon, tauon, the six kinds of quark, photons and the W-boson. [Wacky Physics: The Coolest Little Particles in Nature]

The charges of all these particles are important to their model, because all of them have charges. A quantity called impedance depends on the sum of those charges. The impedance in turn depends on the permittivity of the vacuum, or how much it resists electric fields, as well as its permeability, or how well it supports magnetic fields. Light waves are made up of both an electric and magnetic wave, so changing those quantities (permittivity and permeability) will change the measured speed of light.

"We have calculated the permittivity and permeability of the vacuum as caused by those ephemeral virtual unstable elementary particles," Soto-Sanchez wrote in an email to LiveScience. "It turns out, however, from such a simple model one can discern that those constants contain essentially equal contributions of the different types of electrically charged particle-antiparticle pairs: both, the ones known and those so far unknown to us."

Both papers say that light interacts with virtual particle-antiparticle pairs. In Leuchs' and Sanchez-Soto's model, the impedance of the vacuum (which would speed up or slow down the speed of light) depends on the density of the particles. The impedance relates to the ratio of electric fields to magnetic fields in light; every light wave is made up of both kinds of field, and its measured value, along with the permittivity of space to magnetic fields, governs the speed of light.

Some scientists are a bit skeptical, though. Jay Wacker, a particle physicist at the SLAC National Accelerator Laboratory, said he wasn't confident about the mathematical techniques used, and that it seemed in both cases the scientists weren't applying the mathematical tools in the way that most would. "The proper way to do this is with the Feynman diagrams," Wacker said. "It's a very interesting question [the speed of light]," he added, but the methods used in these papers are probably not sufficient to investigate it.

The other issue is that if there really are a lot of other particles beyond what's in the Standard Model, then this theory needs some serious revision. But so far its predictions have been borne out, notably with the discovery of the Higgs boson. This doesn't mean there aren't any more particles to be found — but if they are out there they're above the energies currently achievable with particle accelerators, and therefore pretty heavy, and it's possible that their effects would have shown up elsewhere.
www.livescience.com/29111-speed-of-light-not-constant.html
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The Speed of Light is Not Constant. 01 Mar 2015 20:45 #3

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Refraction is proof lightspeed is not constant.
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The Speed of Light is Not Constant. 01 Mar 2015 20:56 #4

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Einstein (one stone) and they say Hitler had only one. LOL - sorry couldnt resist


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The Speed of Light is Not Constant. 01 Mar 2015 21:13 #5

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The Speed of Light is Not Constant. 01 Mar 2015 21:15 #6

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The Speed of Light is Not Constant. 01 Mar 2015 21:16 #7

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Voltaire wrote:
Einstein (one stone) and they say Hitler had only one. LOL - sorry couldnt resist

The anagram of Albert Einstein is Ten Elite Brains. :O
1365 = 1

1.1365 = 1,283,305,580,313,352
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The Speed of Light is Not Constant. 01 Mar 2015 21:17 #8

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I never end up with to many comments on my theory but real question and personal conclusion.
Well expose my theories don't have any paper degrees attached to confirm my idea.
Anyone out there which could borrow me there paper degrees for a minute? :chuckle:

Mario wrote:
I once made this Image on the DIF to explain something to myself regarding the speed of light!

If I'm correct with my image theory the Einstein stuff is down the toilet........

Just try be serious about it & get your head around this & the comment I ended up with only confirmed my logical theory because someone else did get my point I made from a very simple & short posting indeed:

Posting I made on the DIF
Nice people using my train question which I never got answered yet in the other thread.
Lets go crazy & a bit mad.......

I just use round figures to make it simple for myself....

All orbits are ellipses in nature they say ..... Why?

Position of acceleration & position of deceleration..... traveling in moving direction & traveling away from overall moving direction "shapes the elliptic?"

Earth speed around the sun 100,000 km/h

Speed of light 300,000 km/s = 1080,000,000 km/h

How is the elliptic shaped around the sun relative to milky way?

How fast travels the sun around the milky-way? = 800,000 km/h


I think that the light speed; speed limit must be bullshit!!!! .... Why not?

Lets just presume the Earth is the train in this case & the Sun system another train... this would mean >>>

There should be situations where all is traveling in the same direction around the milky-way "Yes/No?"

Just to make it simple would mean 100,000 km/h + 800,000 km/h = 900,000 km/h

So if I also would shine a light into travel direction from earth would mean the light should travels with >>>

100,000 km/h + 800,000 km/h + 1080,000,000 km/h = 1080,900,000 km/h = more then the speed of light into travel direction....

So are we time traveling already .... by my theory???? .... Sometimes into the future & sometimes into the past?

Am I mistaken here??? .... or was Einstein living on a non moving rock?

There is still one speed missing ..... the speed of the milky-way around what by what speed??

If the center of the milky-way would be perfectly round shaped it could be stationary.... if not & the center of the milky-way has a elliptic eye shape & should adds even more speed to my example?

Just a theory ..... sorry I never went to the brainwashing university!!!
So by rights I should not know nothing from there indoctrination schoolings.

Which should makes me a free thinker by rights?
silentnomore wrote:
I like your post - it shows a good level of in-depth thinking. However, I believe you have to remember in terms of Einstein (or whomever he stole the theories from, depending on what you believe), everything is relative, meaning that the motion of the Earth around Sol, and Sol around the Galactic Core, is ignored as it is in constant effect. However, I agree with your line of thinking, and I think for scientists to say that the speed of light is unsurpassable is ridiculous. The quote should be "the speed of light is currently the fastest that anything can travel, as far as we know so far."

But yes, I agree wholeheartedly that the speed of light is relative to the motion of the point of origin of the light, and that makes your calculations correct. The reverse also technically applies to light shone in the opposite direction of the Earth's travel through the universe - the speed of light will decrease when you subtract the speed of the Earth's movement through space. It surprises me that this most basic set of circumstances escapes a lot of modern science.

Meh. It's all just different densities of energy vibration anyway. :P

Who knows this also could be the reason why the earth is rotating.
Because one side of earth is facing in travel direction & the opposing side is in the shadow of travel direction & therefore creates a unequal dipole situation which creates a constant flowing current & consequent magnetic field & the rotation effect.

This sort of thing in effect moving around the milky-way. ▼▼▼▼
If a external plasma stream could end up in this shape because of the moving body through Space the speed of light should also differ on different points around the planet body.
Bigger the body higher the gravity or lower I'm not sure.

Higher energy = higher gravity??
Or Higher energy capacitor = Lower gravity?? :dunno:

Again if you could theoretically place a cable around the earth equator how fast would the electricity (Electrons) flow on the external cable surface on four different points having the earth already at a moving speed of 800,000 km/h around the milky way.
Should be more then light speed on down wind directional rotation?? :ponda:

The speed at which energy or signals travel down a cable is actually the speed of the electromagnetic wave, not the movement of electrons. Electromagnetic wave propagation is fast and depends on the dielectric constant of the material. In a vacuum the wave travels at the speed of light and almost that fast in air.
In the theoretical investigation of electric circuits, the velocity of propagation of the electric field through space is usually not considered; the electric field is assumed, as a precondition, to be present throughout space. The electromagnetic component of the field is considered to be in phase with the current, and the electrostatic component is considered to be in phase with the voltage. The electric field starts at the conductor, and propagates through space at the velocity of light (which depends on the material it is traveling through). At any point in space, the electric field corresponds not to the condition of the electric energy flow at that moment, but to that of the flow at a moment earlier. The latency is determined by the time required for the field to propagate from the conductor to the point under consideration. In other words, the greater the distance from the conductor, the more the electric field lags.[1]

Since the velocity of propagation is very high — about 300,000 kilometers per second — the wave of an alternating or oscillating current, even of high frequency, is of considerable length. At 60 cycles per second, the wavelength is 5,000 kilometers, and even at 100,000 hertz, the wavelength is 3 kilometers. This is a very large distance compared to those typically used in field measurement and application.[1]
The important part of the electric field of a conductor extends to the return conductor, which usually is only a few feet distant. At greater distance, the aggregate field can be approximated by the differential field between conductor and return conductor, which tend to cancel. Hence, the intensity of the electric field is usually inappreciable at a distance which is still small compared to the wavelength. Within the range in which an appreciable field exists, this field is practically in phase with the flow of energy in the conductor. That is, the velocity of propagation has no appreciable effect unless the return conductor is very far distant, or entirely absent, or the frequency is so high that the distance to the return conductor is an appreciable portion of the wavelength.[1]

Lets make things more simple ........ what was first the Chicken or the egg? :chuckle:
I say two chickens were first! :wissl:


@ oiram @
Last Edit: 01 Mar 2015 22:25 by Mario.
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The Speed of Light is Not Constant. 01 Mar 2015 21:29 #9

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Voltaire wrote:
Einstein (one stone) and they say Hitler had only one. LOL - sorry couldnt resist

Are you talking bollocks? :D
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The Speed of Light is Not Constant. 02 Mar 2015 11:08 #10

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British physicists prove speed of light is not a constant




For all practical matters and the seemingly impractical matters of astrophysics and particle physics, the speed of light has always been assumed and proven to be a constant in space or a vacuum. Daniel Giovannini with the School of Physics and Astronomy at the University of Glasgow and colleagues have shown that the speed of light changes with the shape of the photons in the light. The discovery was reported in the journal Science on Jan. 22, 2015.

Light contains very small packets of energy called photons. Photons account for the wave and particle nature of light. The researchers manipulated the shape of the photons of a light source and found that the speed of light decreases in space depending on the shape of the photons. The spacing between photons of light is minute and the reality is that photons travel in groups or packets as well as single entities.

The researchers found that single photons and groups of photons slow down at the same rate depending on the complexity of the shape of the photon or group of photons. The speed of light was found to decrease with increasing complexity in the shape of a photon or packet of photons. The discovery was a laboratory manipulation but the slowing of light has been seen in particle accelerators and in some astrophysical phenomena.

The researchers show that their discovery should be applicable to any type of wave. This means that sound and electricity could be manipulated to control speed. Speed in the control of electricity could lead to new circuit developments that were not thought possible. Manipulation of the right frequency of light could turn on faulty enzymes or proteins that cause diseases. This is really a big deal in physics. Light does not travel at a constant speed.
www.examiner.com/article/british-physicists-prove-speed-of-light-is-not-a-constant
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The Speed of Light is Not Constant. 02 Mar 2015 16:21 #11

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The photon is a hoax. The photoelectric effect (not e=mc squared) was what the sham Einstein got his worthless Nobel prize for and it is a fraud.

Read this PLEASE... at least the first bit....

www.scienceforums.com/topic/11645-7-reasons-to-abandon-quantum-mechanics-and-embrace-this-new-theory/
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Third, they are enforced

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The Speed of Light is Not Constant. 02 Mar 2015 17:18 #12

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[quote="novum" post=155346[/quote]

The anagram of Albert Einstein is Ten Elite Brains. :O[/quote]

Albert Einstein is also an anagram of
Eat Tribes Linen
or
Eat Bile Rent Sin
OK, I'll just get my coat.
Last Edit: 02 Mar 2015 17:23 by Daria.
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The Speed of Light is Not Constant. 02 Mar 2015 17:52 #13

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rodin wrote:
The photon is a hoax. The photoelectric effect (not e=mc squared) was what the sham Einstein got his worthless Nobel prize for and it is a fraud.

Read this PLEASE... at least the first bit....

www.scienceforums.com/topic/11645-7-reasons-to-abandon-quantum-mechanics-and-embrace-this-new-theory/

Are you stating that photons don't exist, YES or NO ?
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The Speed of Light is Not Constant. 03 Mar 2015 03:04 #14

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Blue_Tackler wrote:
rodin wrote:
The photon is a hoax. The photoelectric effect (not e=mc squared) was what the sham Einstein got his worthless Nobel prize for and it is a fraud.

Read this PLEASE... at least the first bit....

www.scienceforums.com/topic/11645-7-reasons-to-abandon-quantum-mechanics-and-embrace-this-new-theory/

Are you stating that photons don't exist, YES or NO ?

YES
















.....I am stating that photons don't exist,
To understand who rules over you look to whom you tube can't criticise

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The Speed of Light is Not Constant. 03 Mar 2015 10:59 #15

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So if photons don't exist then it follows that the two slit experiment is fake, and that wave particle duality does not exist thus bringing doubt over quantum physics altogether.

In addition to this 'we'' are also told by science that in a room when a light is turned off, to the question 'where does the light go'? That the photons bounce/reflect/rebound off of surfaces such as walls, ceiling, furniture etc... and with each contact with a surface the photon(s) lose a bit of energy to absorption, where the photons are absorbed by the electrons in the atoms that make up the material, thus the light photon energy has turned to heat, where it is disbursed in the usual way.

So without photons, we have to ask again, where does incandescent light go when the source is no longer being powered in a sealed room, without the existence of photons?

Is it only photons that don't exist or do you say that other subatomic particles don't exist either?
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The Speed of Light is Not Constant. 03 Mar 2015 12:05 #16

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Uploaded on 30 Sep 2011


You can see little balls of light coming from this image. This is the photons. It was taken using a laser... . This also looks like solar flares from the sun. This shows an analogy between a photon packet of energy as related to a high energy photon flare from the sun.
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The Speed of Light is Not Constant. 03 Mar 2015 12:14 #17

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The Speed of Light is Not Constant. 03 Mar 2015 12:33 #18

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The Speed of Light is Not Constant. 03 Mar 2015 12:37 #19

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The Speed of Light is Not Constant. 03 Mar 2015 12:48 #20

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The coke bottle on the last two posts is explained here.

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