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TOPIC: Young people are giving up on democracy

Young people are giving up on democracy 07 Mar 2014 13:06 #1

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In the history of universal suffrage in Britain, young people have never been less important. No wonder that voting holds so little appeal: young people vote less in Britain than anywhere else in the European Union.
Just 38 per cent of Brits under 25 have voted in any election in the past three years, according to Eurobarometer. That's 18 per cent less than the EU average – and half as many as in Malta. And only 39 per cent of under-25s think that voting is a civic duty, compared with 80 per cent of over 65s.

These are the roots of the generational imbalance in British politics: young people don't vote, so politicians have no incentive to improve conditions for them. It's always fashionable to belittle the youth of today and imagine that they are worse than previous generations. The facts mostly tell a different story: today's young are less inclined to use drugs and get drunk than previous generations, and under-18 pregnancy is now at its lowest level since 1969. But it's no myth that young people have never been less inclined to partake in party politics. In 2010, over 65s were 23 per cent more likely to vote in the general election than under 25s. This "generation gap" didn't exist in 1964; as recently as 1992, it was only 12 per cent.

Expect it to be even worse in 2015: the main reason for the modest spike in young voting in 2010 was a surge in support for the Liberal Democrats, who now hope that the young will only remember the tuition fee increase as "that thing off Newsround" come the next election, as one MP put it to me. The Conservatives point to doubling apprenticeships in Government – but under-25 unemployment remains over 900,000, while the party is prone to indulging in unworkable suggestions like scrapping all housing benefit for under-25s. Labour has proposed a youth jobs guarantee to curb unemployment, and has high hopes that the community organiser Arnie Graf can increase turnout among the young, but only 28 per cent bothered to vote in the recent Wynthenshawe and Sale East by-election. All three parties make delusional noises about replicating the effects that social media had on Barack Obama's victories. Pull the other one: the three main parties have a combined 400,000 likes on Facebook; the US president has 40 million. The young see nothing they like in Ukip, either: only five per cent of under-25 voters would plump for purple......

blogs.telegraph.co.uk/news/timwigmore/100261035/young-people-are-giving-up-on-democracy/

Infowarrior •
"Democracy is tyranny of the majority, being controlled by 51% isn't freedom. Democracy is two wolves and a sheep, voting on what's for supper. Adding insult to injury, leaders of both the so-called 'left' and the 'right' answer to the same masters of the universe. For generations the public has been played like a fiddle, divide and conquer, oldest trick in the book, besides prostitution of course."
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Young people are giving up on democracy 07 Mar 2014 13:17 #2

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The US is also suffering very low voter turnouts in its recent elections, but for different reasons. I was listening to the (Australian) radio recently and heard an interview with a political academic who was taken to Stanford University to talk about two aspects of the Australian system Americans (supposedly) admire:

1. Compulsory voting; and
2. Preferential voting.

Australia and Belgium are the only western nations I'm aware of with compulsory voting. If you don't vote in Oz you get fined. People though can get their name struck off the electoral roll then cast a "donkey" vote (an invalid one).

Preferential voting (in the US context) supposedly would remedy the situation where the leader is actually the person with the largest minority vote.

The Australian system is nothing wonderful in my opinion, but don't be surprised if you hear more talk of compulsory voting and preferential voting
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Young people are giving up on democracy 07 Mar 2014 13:26 #3

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pheony wrote:
In the history of universal suffrage in Britain, young people have never been less important. No wonder that voting holds so little appeal: young people vote less in Britain than anywhere else in the European Union.

This explains alot but there is no need for me to elaborate...

The only way to change the world is infiltrate the system from the inside.

But pseudo intellectuals will always tell people don't bother voting and Obama is the same as Romney, Mccain, Bush.

People still living good over here and the system is far from crashing so if you don't vote you miss out on small victory's.

The people who say don't vote are usually pseudo intellectuals who grow old spending their life waiting for the system to crash.
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Young people are giving up on democracy 07 Mar 2014 13:33 #4

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Without the free flow of information, how can voters know what they are voting for, so is what we have a democracy?
As those voted for have no duty to do what they said they would do, and most often don't undertake the actions they said they would do to gain power, is what we have a democracy?
The oligarchy decide what we can read, who we can vote for, and what is done.
What Democracy?
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Young people are giving up on democracy 07 Mar 2014 13:37 #5

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Very true, jonb.... "What Democracy"?
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Young people are giving up on democracy 07 Mar 2014 13:38 #6

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.......... wrote:

The only way to change the world is infiltrate the system from the inside.

No that does not work, to gain sufficient power within he system to be able to change its course means you will have to do such harm on the way up to prove yourself, that by the point you can make a change the harm you will have done will outweigh and possible good you could do.
Last Edit: 07 Mar 2014 13:38 by jonb.
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Young people are giving up on democracy 07 Mar 2014 13:38 #7

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They need to be encouraged to do a different thing.

Go to the Polling Station.

Collect your ballot paper

Fold it up nicely

Put it in your pocket

Walk Out.

There is no law to say you have to cast your vote, but they record all ballots taken, if they are not cast, this shows differently to a "None of the Above" spoiled ballots, but shows people a way to vote... for No One, whilst still going to vote.

Just an idea, doubt it will take off, to many people are asleep and under the spell of the TV
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Young people are giving up on democracy 07 Mar 2014 13:39 #8

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jonb what can people do to gain this Democracy you speak of?
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Young people are giving up on democracy 07 Mar 2014 13:41 #9

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jonb wrote:
.......... wrote:

The only way to change the world is infiltrate the system from the inside.

No that does not work, to gain sufficient power within he system to be able to change its course means you will have to do such harm on the way up to prove yourself, that by the point you can make a change the harm you will have done will outweigh and possible good you could do.

This is how i use to think 5 years ago, what are your other solutions?
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Young people are giving up on democracy 07 Mar 2014 14:25 #10

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I think I may have a few parts of the jigsaw, I have been thinking about his for a while, and I want to get in a position where I can start playing and fitting them with bits other people can bring to the game. I am not yet ready to play, but once my head is in order, game on.
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Young people are giving up on democracy 07 Mar 2014 20:25 #11

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I think the failure of today's youth to engage with the 3-party Politicial bullshit is a mixture of disillusion (how blatant can the politicians make it that they have no intention of serving the people) and a lack of interest (Twitter, FB etc). They've got hooked on trivial stuff and minutae, and given the crap they see going on around them (lack of future, screwed financially, the traditional family model being dismantled), who can blame them for thinking it's all a con and why should they give a damn.
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Young people are giving up on democracy 07 Mar 2014 20:30 #12

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I see no wrong in defacing your ballot paper or better yet, writing the words "I have no faith in any of the mentioned candidates to do ay more than serve their own interests at my expense".
Alternatively "You're all inept, selfish twats".
Last Edit: 07 Mar 2014 20:30 by vambo.
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Young people are giving up on democracy 07 Mar 2014 22:48 #13

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If you're not happy with the system but still hope it can be changed then you could try signing petitions like the one below. It proposes that something meaningful (well more substantial than present options) comes from a 'none of the above' vote. At least by trying to get it on the ballot papers then it can't be conveniently misconstrued.

you.38degrees.org.uk/petitions/inclusion-of-an-official-none-of-the-above-option-for-all-uk-elections-2
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Young people are giving up on democracy 08 Mar 2014 07:06 #14

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Democracy is an illusion.

We are sold the idea that we have got a choice, but in reality we haven't. It makes us think that we're involved with the process of governance, we aren't. It really doesn't matter which politically party is voted in, the same major policies will be enacted, all parties will raise taxes, all parties will go to war, all parties will do exactly what the true controllers want them to.

The illusion is exactly the same illusion that is played on us with Coke and Pepsi, Macdonals and Burger king, we pick one that we prefer at the expense of the other, when in reality they are almost exactly the same, remember the Pepsi challenge? Then we identify our being with our choices and defend them.

So long as we carry out these choices unconsciously, we are easy to control and, manipulate especially as they control the media also.

The system is rigged 100% and not in the peoples favour.

What democracy? We live in a dictatorship with an illusion of choice.
It was always going to happen!!
Last Edit: 08 Mar 2014 09:48 by wolfy.
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Young people are giving up on democracy 08 Mar 2014 08:06 #15

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wolfy wrote:
Democracy is an illusion.

We are sold the idea that we have got a choice, but in reality we haven't. It makes us think that we involved with the process of governance, we aren't. It really doesn't matter which politically party is voted in, the same major policies will be enacted, all parties will raise taxes, all parties will go to war, all parties will do exactly what the true controllers want them to.

The illusion is exactly the same illusion that is played on us with Coke and Pepsi, Macdonals and Burger king, we pick one that we prefer at the expense of the other, when in reality they are almost exactly the same, remember the Pepsi challenge? Then we identify our being with our choices and defend them.

So long as we carry out these choices unconsciously, we are easy to control and, manipulate especially as they control the media also.

The system is rigged 100% and not in the peoples favour.

What democracy? We live in a dictatorship with an illusion of choice.


I just want to say that this post is really not Mike like. :larf:

Anyway...



I remember the good old days, when 90+ year olds in nursing homes lived forever. Darn this pesky virus.

1365 = 1

1.1365 = 1,283,305,580,313,352
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Young people are giving up on democracy 08 Mar 2014 13:10 #16

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novum wrote:
I just want to say that this post is really not Mike like. :larf:

Anyway...



Exactly, but it's not just politics that is like this, absolutely everything in dualistic existence is like this.

The hermetic maxim of polarity effects absolutely everything, think hot and cold, they are not separate, but are varying degrees of the same thing and at extremes, both will burn the skin.

Principle of Polarity
The Principle of Polarity embodies the idea that everything is dual, everything has two poles, and everything has its opposite.[7] All manifested things have two sides, two aspects, or two poles.[8] Everything "is" and "isn't" at the same time, all truths are but half truths and every truth is half false, there are two sides to everything, opposites are identical in nature, yet different in degree, extremes meet, and all paradoxes may be reconciled


It is the same with politics, As Mr Griffin points out. Extreme ideologies meet and are actually the same, the PTB understand this and use it to keep the masses subdued and under control, this is what people need waking up to firstly, the more you understand the clearer things become.

As above, so below.
It was always going to happen!!
Last Edit: 08 Mar 2014 13:39 by wolfy.
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Young people are giving up on democracy 05 Apr 2015 07:36 #17

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jonb wrote:
.......... wrote:

The only way to change the world is infiltrate the system from the inside.

No that does not work, to gain sufficient power within he system to be able to change its course means you will have to do such harm on the way up to prove yourself, that by the point you can make a change the harm you will have done will outweigh and possible good you could do.
Right.
The Founding Fathers of the USA suggested cleaning house every twenty years or the Republic would degenerate into a democracy and then fall.The Fall is near.
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Young people are giving up on democracy 05 Apr 2015 10:40 #18

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Generic wrote:
I think the failure of today's youth to engage with the 3-party Politicial bullshit is a mixture of disillusion (how blatant can the politicians make it that they have no intention of serving the people) and a lack of interest (Twitter, FB etc). They've got hooked on trivial stuff and minutae, and given the crap they see going on around them (lack of future, screwed financially, the traditional family model being dismantled), who can blame them for thinking it's all a con and why should they give a damn.

The traditional family has long been dismantled since WihelmReich linked it to Fascism.

Despite being more socially conservative than the baby boomers, the millennial generation is ironically dropping out of society partly due to reasonably coming to the conclusion that they are irrelevant to democracy and partly due to the nihilism of the social media era.
Last Edit: 05 Apr 2015 10:43 by N°6.
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Young people are giving up on democracy 05 Apr 2015 10:46 #19

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zax wrote:
jonb wrote:
.......... wrote:

The only way to change the world is infiltrate the system from the inside.

No that does not work, to gain sufficient power within he system to be able to change its course means you will have to do such harm on the way up to prove yourself, that by the point you can make a change the harm you will have done will outweigh and possible good you could do.
Right.
The Founding Fathers of the USA suggested cleaning house every twenty years or the Republic would degenerate into a democracy and then fall.The Fall is near.

I was under the impression that that was the whole point of a revolutionary state. The revolution wasn't supposed to end when yesterday's revolutionaries conveniently became today's conservatives in order to keep the power they won yesterday.

Because of this we have the bizarre situation whereby boomer Trotskyites are today's (neo) conservatives.
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